SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

ok, it looks like you are regaining some control now. I understand that some advice and urgency here on SI might seem a bit extreme, but many of us suffered greatly because of our own hesitance (just look at my signature or profile).

Dear Mantorok,

Please listen to the recommendations of the posters. Many of us have been in your shoes. I wish I has SI to guide me through my process. If I were you, I would forego the vacation and take that time to prepare a strategy for your divorce. STRIKE NOW!!!!

Best,

Bigheart

It is very early for you after discovery (and I'll remind the other posters that the OP's started this thread... yesterday). Coming from someone who's been around the block a bit I thought I'd remind you of a few things.

This is not a court of law. No one really "wins" and no one really "loses." Your wife won't be "homeless" because, since you're the primary breadwinner, you will need to provide her with basic support, at the very least. Furthermore, you already know what's going on - I don't think that you, or anyone reading this, would think to themselves, "Yeah, he's just a friend." Everyone, including your wife, understands what the situation is - meaning, no one is in the dark.

So let's take this from THAT perspective. We're all in agreement that your wife is doing something totally unacceptable.

What is the goal here? It's to move YOU out of infidelity. It's not to save your marriage or even to make you feel better. Often, feeling better takes years - no matter what action your wife (or you) ultimately takes. You need to get yourself out of this shitty situation.

Think about this for a second. Your wife is doing something (no matter WHAT it is) that is hurting you terribly. I would hope that people don't get married for that purpose. A wife who is PURPOSEFULLY hurting her husband, and who KNOWS she's hurting her husband... AND WON'T STOP... is a special type of a-hole. Look, I get that people have affairs and now, after years of dealing with this, I get that people in an affair don't think about their spouse. But your wife DOES. She KNOWS that you know and she's still unwilling to end it. She is now hurting you ON PURPOSE.

So what do you do? If she was taking a hammer and hitting you on the head you'd ask her to stop. If she kept doing it you'd finally get angry and put an end to it. You'd take control of the situation and do what you needed to do in order to stop her from hitting you.

So do it! Tell her, directly to her face without any anger - but in a way that she knows that you're not fucking around - that her interaction with this guy ends immediately. If he's a coworker then she quits immediately. No further contact, etc. You know the deal. In short, you lay down YOUR requirements in a way that is perfectly clear. Then, simply let her know that want to try to work things out but you cannot and will not work anything out while there's a third person in the marriage. Lastly, you let her know that, since there's another person in the marriage, you will be taking steps to end the marriage unless she decides to change her tune.

Then... and this is super important... stop being the cash cow. Do you pay for her phone? Cancel it. Does she have internet access at home? Cancel your coverage. Is her car in your name? Return it or sell it. Tell her parents. Tell her siblings. Start making it difficult for her. Let her see what life is going to be like as a divorced woman.

Last thing - if I could live the last 6-7 years over again there is ONE thing I would do... and that is to have been stronger and firmer in the days following discovery. I should have laid down the hammer and found my balls sooner. It is the one regret I have in life... and I am fully and totally reconciled with my wife.

Please, think about that. If your marriage survives, great. But no matter WHAT happens, you will always have to live with yourself knowing how you acted in these early days.

Good luck!

[This message edited by LifeisCrazy at 9:31 AM, July 16th (Monday)]

So do it! Tell her, directly to her face without any anger - but in a way that she knows that you're not fucking around - that her interaction with this guy ends immediately. If he's a coworker then she quits immediately. No further contact, etc. You know the deal. In short, you lay down YOUR requirements in a way that is perfectly clear. Then, simply let her know that want to try to work things out but you cannot and will not work anything out while there's a third person in the marriage. Lastly, you let her know that, since there's another person in the marriage, you will be taking steps to end the marriage unless she decides to change her tune.

Thanks for your post, I probably didn't mention it in my OP but I've had this conversation with her numerous times, every time we talk I keep re-iterating that contact must cease - she won't do it, and claims that we can get through this if she keeps the "friend" relationship side and avoids the "partner" side - yeah, I too was thinking HTF would that work?????? I have also said if it doesn't cease then it's game over. I even tried to explain to her the affect it would have on my repair if I'm still wondering what she's doing every time shes out of sight and with him!

So from the responses on here are telling me, it IS game over, and it's now time to act on that, not just talk about it.

mantorok, sorry you have reached this point.

She will not change (1), you will never be happy with the current situation, so you're at a stalemate.

You have possibly read a lot of times on here that in order to try and save a marriage you must be prepared to lose it. This is where I think you are.

You now need to go see an lawyer and get all your ducks in a line to protect you and your children and have papers served on her. This generally causes a dramatic change in the ws outlook on life as suddenly there are consequences to their decision/actions. Suddenly this fairytale life they are living is destroyed. This may make her change her outlook (1).

You also need to tell AP's wife, she has a right to know, from what you say she might already know more than you, so maybe she can provide you with some of the information you are trying to get out the wife. Then you can call her bullshit, just do not reveal sources.

I would also seriously consider not going on holiday, use the time to consult lawyers etc.

Good luck, it's going to get rougher.

Go have a STD test, even if you think it is highly improbable and make sure she knows, again maybe another wake up call. Talking has not produced any results you are comfortable so now it's time for action.

Only you can decide if it is game over.

What is lacking in your boundaries with your wayward wife is consequences.

You say no more sex with the OM. Your wife denies sex has occurred but still overnights at his house and hotel room. You, she, and everyone knows she is lying and they are engaged in sex.

You say "no contact." She disagrees and says "contact will be maintained."

Please review the article Boundaries and Consequences 101 For All New BS's.

Your wayward wife is choosing to blatantly hurt you. You are in infidelity. We want you out for you and your family. I think you would agree it is a horrible existence.

Your wayward wife is having everything her way. She has her family and financial support while she screws other men. The reason is because she lacks character and has never experienced consequences. This dynamic has to change.

On SI we have a mantra that you have to be prepared to lose your marriage in order to save it.

What we want is for you to have a plan to get out of infidelity. Many times when dealing with an abusive spouse that refuses to stop cheating the BS does have to divorce them or live their life in infidelity.

You know what you want. We do not.

What happens in your marriage is up to you and your wife and your corresponding responses. If reconciliation is not possible then divorce becomes the only option.

The important thing is to get out of infidelity.

I probably didn't mention it in my OP but I've had this conversation with her numerous times

...

it IS game over, and it's now time to act on that, not just talk about it

Yes, talking doesn't work with cheaters. "If you continue communicating with him I will be very hurt" doesn't work on cheaters. One of the common traits of cheaters is extreme selfishness and complete lack of empathy.

And no, it is not game over (depending on what you mean by "game over"). It is still possible to recover and reconcile, but not with her current attitude.

Your WW's opinion that she can keep her "friend" is all the answer you need.

1. She is selfish. Her needs for her friend are more important that your need to trust your W.

2. She is either still lying or in denial about what went on. Even if it is only an EA (which from what you have written, I highly doubt), her relationship is clearly inappropriate.

3. Her "friend" is more important to her than her H.

Just on the basis of that, you should be able to see that your WW is not a safe partner and is not worth your time trying to R. She is not interested in it, you have already said she wants to rugsweep and she wants you to pretend everything is back to normal.

So from the responses on here are telling me, it IS game over, and it's now time to act on that, not just talk about it

OK not that I mean to be harsh but seriously, your wife is openly dating another man, you would have to have your head up your proverbial behind to think she hasn't slept with him yet and you need somebody else to tell you its time to stop talking and start acting?????????

personally I think its an exit affair. she let you catch her to push you into ending the marriage. you didn't do it so she is ramping up the campaign to rub your nose in it until you reach your breaking point. either she doesn't want to be the one to pull the plug so she's trying to force you into it or she wants to play the ,"oh poor me," victim card so she gets a little sympathy through the divorce, or most likely, she trying to push you into filing so she will feel free to date him and blame the divorce on you so she can use it to justify moving on.

[This message edited by leftbroken at 1:24 PM, July 16th (Monday)]

Do you think if your 10 day vaycay turned into a 5 day vaycay that you might be able catch her in the act?

I don't think it will bring her back to the M but may hurry up the D.

To answer your question - yes the game is up if she continues to feed you that bullshit ‘friends’ line. You were not put on this earth to accept being treated like this.

Your wife and her boyfriend have probably made plans for a 10-day fuckfest while you're away.They'd hate your guts if you stayed home.

LifeisCrazy nailed it. Read and re-read that post, as well as others. I'm an old-timer around here (look at my membership #), and I lived through my own personal hell of infidelity, as well as helping others through theirs.

I agree with the many posters that have said the 10-days away is probably a bad idea at this juncture. I understand that you need time to process all of this in a solitary environment. I get that - I really do. BUT, your life is blowing up around you, and I don't know anyone that would advise to take a 10 day holiday and let it just burn.

IF you feel that you must get away, I REALLY like MickeyBill's suggestion:

Do you think if your 10 day vaycay turned into a 5 day vaycay that you might be able catch her in the act?

I think ^^this^^ would be priceless! Only stay for 5 days, but don't tell your wife you're cutting the vacay short. "Surprise" her when you come back waaaaaaayy sooner than expected and see what you find on the VAR and watch her squirm and panic when you walk in the door. THEN, get D papers served on her ASAP. She is fence-sitting and cake eating, and she needs a 2x4 of reality to hit her with both barrels.

I know you want that "true confession", but my guess is you will never get it. A lot of us had our "sticking points" - mine was that I wanted my exH to crawl back to me so I could reject him. Didn't happen, and I wallowed in anger for nearly 18 months and in IC. It was my IC that told me that I needed to find a way to move on without that.

And you know what? I DID. I'm 15+ years from my D-day, and I am more content in my life now than I ever was with my exH.

There IS life after divorce, AND after infidelity. But you must take ACTION to get yourself OUT of infidelity.

My WH tried to tell me he'd end the "partner" side of the relationship with OW and that they would just be best friends. What. A. Liar. He continued the PA for another 4 months before I had another DDay and had to end our 25-year M.

It isn't easy. It's scary as hell, but in the end, you have to pull that trigger. A huge weight was lifted from my tired shoulders the second I said, "No more. I will not live this way."

Left broken I think you have a valid point. If he files than she can play the victim and in her mind blame him for the divorce. This is what my husband did to me. Not only did he cheat and ruined our family but he made it so unbearable for me that I had to pull the plug. He can say I ruined the marriage because I initiated this which is total bullshit.

From reading your posts, I get the impression that you say one thing but probably you seem as though you are still desperate for some sort of rise out of her.

She is still insistent on keeping her lover and your hanging bout like a puppy dog waiting for to admit some thing. It ISN'T going to happen.

Did you ask her for a lie detector test as yet?

Suggest you learn very quickly how to calculate your moves and execute them coldly.

Are you able to do that?

I'm from another generation and really don't understand something. I read where guys know their spouse is hooking up with another man and the BS never confronts the AP. Everyone is afraid they will get arrested. You don't get arrested unless you start a fight. If he starts the fight then it's called self defense. You confront him and he either admits it or he backs off. The second year of our marriage my wife was hit on and physically/sexually touched. The day after I found out I was in his face and threating him with physical harm. He knew I was deadly serious and he backed down like a little whipped puppy. I don't understand because I'm from a generation where if she's not worth fighting for then she's not worth having. This AP is only 50 miles away and you are letting him get away with such disrespect. I do wish you well.

I've been 180 for the last couple of days and she's already picked up that I'm getting on with my life, I've been acting happy around her and she has been looking miserable.

She offered to come away for the first 2 days of my vacation and I said we need to back off, she's also trying to be nice and get us back on track but she now knows I'm having none of it, I am completely detaching myself from her. She is now trying to turn the other cheek, I can sense it, when I file she is then going to blame me for the break-up, I know that and fully expect it. She thought I thought she was lying about something the other day and the last 2 days she's been trying convince me she wasn't lying, turns out she was telling the truth but it wasn't a truth worth lying about in the first place. You know what I'm saying, she's now trying to convince me that she's Miss Fucking Honesty because she didn't lie about a trivial thing. I'm under no illusions about what's going on here and it's thanks to you guys.

I'm still picking up more bits of proof, the var is arriving today and I think I will need another one for car/bedroom for when I'm away, I am cutting my vacation short and I've told her that, but I will be coming back a day or two earlier than she thinks I am.

I'm also considering filing BEFORE i leave.

I do now feel that I'm at the point where I'm not going to discover the full story, there is some proof but it's not from the horses mouth so to speak, I'm hoping the var will give me closure, I guess what some of you said is true, I want it to be exposed as a PA just so that any doubt is completely gone, I know that's not the right thing to do, and it is a sticking point that I'm trying to work through now. But as I'm sure all of you will understand, that's really difficult for me because I'm so angry and just want to tell her what a filthy lying cheating scumbag she is.

Your goal is to get out of infidelity as fast as possible. File now, there's nothing more powerful than d papers to bring clarity.

She wants her marriage--and stray dick, too.

I think Mantorok that one of the problems is that because you're gathering yourself together to take action, she is just seeing nothing happening. And the status quo suits her.

You have enough to know it's a full-blown A but the biggest thing I would point to is that despite what's happened so far and how unhappy you are she is insisting on continuing to see him. There is absolutely no way she would do that if she was not locked in.

So as another poster said, you don't have a M right now. Whether you want one with her or whether it's heading for D, you need to blow this up somehow. It's a shame the AP is not married (BTW I had the 'he's like a gay friend' shit too) as that's the fastest way for reality to hit the fan. I'd consider telling her family. At the moment she's seeing a 'pick-me' dance. She needs some reality shone on what's happening here because right now she is deluded. She needs to understand that having a H at home and an AP on speed dial is not the life she is moving towards.

I'm 100% with Bigheart2018 and feel that although you want to get away, the vacation is not your priority, preparing for D is and you should be throwing your energy into that. So cancel it - step one is to go and get legal advice urgently.

Good luck.