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Well said Oldtruck.

And I'd add:

my family was too important to me to risk loosing it

Thank you, Robert22205

[This message edited by oldtruck at 7:09 AM, March 6th (Wednesday)]

Roller coaster ride has begun. Asked for and heard some of the gory details last night. It was both weirdly comforting and deeply disturbing that I felt like I was finally hearing some truth, despite what I was hearing. It felt like pulling a bandaid off.

Have you read Joseph’s letter in the healing library?

Hopefully your WH having to put voice to those actions and be in your presence while he did it made him see them for the grotesque betrayals they really were. Especially that decision tree. I hope he's deeply ashamed of himself for that.

That's why I think a timeline is a good thing. It makes the WS face what they did step by step along the way. I'm glad you feel you are finally getting the truth.

BS ONLY

[This message edited by SI Staff at 7:00 PM, October 14th (Monday)]

Every BS has their own way of healing. However, many betrayed spouses want to hear everything down to every little "dirty detail". This is for two reasons:

1. The mind of a betrayed spouse will construct imagined "dirty details" if it does not know the truth. This can become a rabbit hole of imagination hell. Knowing the reality can put a stop to this.

2. The A carved an "intimacy hole" into your marriage, where you WH shared a chunk of intimacy with the AP that should have been shared with you. In fact, he was sneaking and lying to you, while being honest with the AP. In ways, he was more intimate with her. Having him tell every detail is, as noted, a way of restoring that intimacy to the marriage continuum. As painful as it is to hear, many BS's find that the healing value of the authenticity and honesty and intimacy outweighs the pain of knowing what they did.

Jsmart:

it's important that he confess it all. There should be no special memory that he gets to keep.

This^^^^ resonated and succinctly describes how many of us feel when the WS won't come completely clean.

And I'd add: "There should be no special memory that he gets to keep that excludes you."

I feel emotionally drained. Yesterday, we discussed timelines - he’s still working on it - and my sleuthing uncovered that the A didn’t end when I had assumed (and it was an assumption), but rather didn’t formally end until the NC letters went out. They were working toward it, trying to end it, but hadn’t formally done so. And that their last encounter happening after my assumed date, meant that the four of us WH, AP, and both BS’s spent a weekend racing together. That was a tough one. Still smacking myself in the head over the AP’s “friendship” and all the times I seriously apologized to her for feeling so threatened or “acting crazy” about the training time spent together. I really did want to be her friend - and if she and my WH hadn’t been so inappropriately connected, we’d have likely been friends (on another planet clearly).

Timeline is forthcoming today. WH has been avoiding it, he says, because he’s tried to block it out of his mind....doesn’t want to say more he knows will likely hurt me....and today when pressed into it....had his own panic attack. He’s not often super emotional, and I could tell acknowledging the destruction he wrought by his and the AP choices was overwhelming him. But, it’s a bandaid I need to rip off. I can be gracious in acknowledging the emotion, but it’s his consequence for his choice and his responsibility to deal with. WH is checking in a frequently. IC is scheduled by WH for WH. MC is amazing! We’ve got a great MC who doesn’t fall for baloney and points it out. She mentioned, that regardless of happy marriage or unhappy marriage, people end up in affairs. Often without this as the intended result. And that NO ONE gets there without a fair amount of lying to themselves before getting further from who they thought they were. I found some comfort there.

FWIW, from a random guy on the internet I think that you are doing very well LB.

For so long he and the AP had the upper hand, they knew this giant secret that you had no clue about. Their special relationship going on just under you and the OBS noses.

It must have been intoxicating for them when you 4 were together. Sharing a glance, a laugh, a touch- all "innocent"

Now he is in a corner, he doesn't know what you know. He is not sure what to tell you or what to lie about and keep from you. If the and AP are in NC they can't collude.

Does he know that you and OBS are in contact?

He's not used to not being in charge, hence his panic attack.

I'm glad you have an MC who "gets it" and won't buy into any bullshit, Ladybug. Quite often their patient is the marri8age and they shift at least some of the responsibility to the BS. Don't allow that to happen.

You're still so fresh to this it is overwhelming to you. Don't take any blame on yourself in buying into them just being training partners and squelching your own suspicions (gut). We want to believe our spouses. It's our nature to believe them even if we still have uneasiness in the back of our minds. It's natural. I sure did it, too, as many have.

It sounds to me like your WH is making the right noises now. Will they persist is the questions. Actions over words. It will take long-term, consistent, permanent change in behaviour (doing the right thing) before you can really feel safe.

It seems like your WH might be a candidate for R. It is really too early to tell though. Even if he does all the right things you don't have to R. Perhaps adultery is a deal breaker and you just don't know yet. It really is about what is best for you.

Whether R or D there is a long road ahead for you. A common statement here is 2 to 5 years to heal. It depends on how many setbacks (TT, new revelations, backsliding) when the calendar starts flipping or when you have to start over. It doesn't matter R or D it's a long time.

My advice, generally, is to not make any major life decisions to early and when very emotional. They tend not to be good decisions. Take time for yourself and make decisions that are best for you. It might be R. It might be D.

Hang in there. It appears to me that you are going through a very typical, normal emotional state. Be good to yourself.

With respect to the timeline:

WH has been avoiding it, he says, because he’s tried to block it out of his mind..

That timeline is his (and your) reality and is something he must face before he can fix and make himself safe for you.

I agree with MickeyBill2016 that his emotional reaction is likely driven by him (the fixer) trying to control the outcome. However, the outcome is not up to him - it's up to you. Stay in control.

Your emotions are normal. You've suffered a double betrayal. Your husband and the OW had time to plan every word and every gesture. Of course you were deceived (but at least you were aware enough to challenge them). As I recall, in addition, you had an even tougher hill to climb because the OBS was very vocal in defending their relationship as innocent.

Just to clarify as it seems people are not making a big deal out of it and I may be wrong - but did I read it correctly that your husband was breaking No Contact up until, or near-until, the NC letters had been sent? How was that addressed?

Had a particularly rough night. Woke up in the middle of the night in a panic scrolling through his phone.....which was sad and pathetic. Though, uncovered nothing. Double therapy sessions basically confirming our family histories and our commitment to moving forward.....Family history for me is always tough and often times bringing it up makes me feel like damaged goods-which I shared with the AP/trying to be my pal person...as a potential reason why I might “overreact” to what was going on (ICK). WH knew what we were dealing with early on (Abuse, neglect, homelessness....though I’m crazy grateful that I went into IC in college - and have had found so much support for this that I feel like I have earned the emotional intelligence to have seen this trainwreck coming months ago....but couldn’t find a way to stop it). AND....yea! We’re both fully committed to R...... or should be committed. One minute I’m a badass, the next trying to carefully walk with WH through newfound honesty...the next sobbing uncontrollably.

Finally, got my timeline. Jived with OBS and my super sleuthing. All this learning of gory details a few days ago...which was a warped way of hearing honesty....is such a creepy relief. Getting the times was just sad. Most of the rendezvous revolved on us fighting over how much time and emotional involvement WH and AP were spending together. So, I’d get upset over it and they thought the solution was to f$%#.

WH is totally in “fix” mode. I know feelings have to be felt and not fixed. I don’t think WH and AP intended to go down this path. Though, I think they were both lying to themselves long before lying to me and OBS.

Went to “our” (creepy) Y this morning to try to get back into my training. Found myself driving the parking lot twice for uncomfortably familiar cars and then compulsively checking for all women bearing the slightest resemblance to the AP in the locker room. It made me feel small. I’m not sure that this AP/woman, given all the ick, can say anything to me that will ever change my opinion of her. I know that’s demonizing her....and it takes to hands to clap.....but I don’t have a vested interest in a hot minute of that “friendship”. The small town has shrunk by a magnitude of 10. Had a great run, interrupted by hysterical sobs....and a crappy swim because I haven’t eaten enough to have the endurance of a snail. But, bonus....the 14 year old’s baby weight is history. Have taken to logging food, drinking milk shakes and eating carbs - that wouldn’t have crossed my lips in months.

WH has voluntarily loaded tracking apps on his phone....so I know where he is. Feeling mangled and managed and hoping for, dear God please, a full night’s sleep.

I shared with the AP/trying to be my pal person

Have you confronted her? You deserve to be heard by her. To look her dead in eye and tell her what you think. If you think it would help you...

Sending strength!

No, I have not and will not seek out to confront her. I might go axe throwing or hangliding to work out my anger- but though I might “deserve” to confront her.....I just don’t see the point.

Agreed. Why give someone so much lower than yourself that kind of power over you?

BS ONLY

[This message edited by SI Staff at 7:01 PM, October 14th (Monday)]

The WH needs to show more empathy. can he really imagine how he would feel if LadyBugMaam had done this to him. could he imagine being fixed by her. how would he have reacted etc.

Has the OBS confronted your WH? He deserves to be heard by your cheating WH. He also deserves to look at your WH dead in the eye and tell him what he thinks of him. I would hope your WH also has the good sense to stay away from the gym as a consequence of his cheating. The OBS should not be forced to worry about his presence. Good luck to you.