SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

You're scared. That's why you won't do a poly, or get a var. That's why you won't insist she quit her job. Fear.

You would rather blanket yourself denial, than find the truth.

Hell Fire just gave you all you need to know in a few sentences.

If you find out the truth, guess what that means???/ DECISION TIME. Either you do something to stop it or put your head in the sand and suffer. YOU ARE AVOIDING this at all costs because you are not out of the "denial" stage of grief yet.

None of the advise you are getting is going to help you, despite you saying it does, until you get to the fucking ANGER stage.

Just look at the number of experienced strangers who are almost 100% in agreement and we do not know each other from ADAM.

very small odds the group is wrong my friend.

Hi Masters,

I'm hoping you are still reading even if you've decided not to respond. I just want to add that people do care for you and I don't think anyone on here doesn't understand what you're going through.But you come here for advice and that is what you are getting. There are threads here, BeyondRage's is one, where people see a chance for reconciliation. Take a look there. You'll see the stark difference between the actions of his WW and your's. This is not a place that just advocates Divorce at all costs (Well some posters probably do but they are not the majority) but it is one that I think advocates being honest above all with yourself about what is going on. Just try to look at all of the things that you have been told and found out as if you were on a jury. What would to conclude? I think you would conclude like all of us have that your WW has lied to you about the extent of the Affair and continues to lie to you about whether it is continuing.

I think you somehow think that Divorce is the worst thing that could happen to you. I can assure you as someone that is divorced and remarried to a wonderful woman that it is not. You know what was the worst thing that could happen? Allowing my WW's Affair to slow burn for years and pop back up whenever either of them got bored. Living for so many years with a woman that really did not love me but stayed with me because her AP would not leave his wife and I had a good job, knowing now that my wonderful wife was out there to be found years earlier, that is the worst thing that happened to me and I submit that right now, this that you are going through and allowing to continue, this is the worst thing that could happen. Choosing now to get out of Infidelity is the best thing that could happen.

Your WW can still join you out of Infidelity but she has to change and you have to quit being weak. Tell her

"I've decided that being alone is not the worst thing that could happen here. Sharing you emotionally and physically with another man is instead the worst thing that could happen. I am no longer going to do that. It is up to you whether I stop sharing you by divorcing or I stop because you are no longer in this Affair. I am moving on with or without you."

And then start. Hire a lawyer, file for Divorce, expose the Affair to the CEO, split your finances, etc. Nothing happens overnight. There will be plenty of time for your WW to convince you that she is not in the Affair. You should not have to find it out. Assume she is until she proves otherwise.

Maybe I can explain something about your wife.

She is an addict. She is addicted and will give up everything to get her fix.

She needs that fix. It is what she wakes up needing. She sits in the car or on a plane, and wonders how she is going to get that fix again.

Have you seen a drug addict before? They steal from the people they love because they try to fill that whole. They lie. They see the lying as necessary to keep back the pain from being without that fix. They think the drugs make them whole.

The person you love is the drugs is how they see it.

So they convince themselves the lie is out of love.

She is still seeing him because the part that was broken that needed the AP. That is still in her. She can't stop using the drugs. It is still a part of her. She needs to fix that part and start getting it from herself and then from you.

The difference between a drunk and an alcoholic is that one is going to meetings and trying to better themselves. Your wife isn't an alcoholic yet. So the words of a drunk are just words.

Could she delete emails without you being able to see them? You know, empty the recycle bin in her emails. Sadly, that is probably where the affair is at now.

If you want advice, the best advice is to get yourself some space and tell her you don't trust her. Then put steps into place to make her start to prove she is being a good wife. You keep reaching to save her. Make her save you. It's about time she tried to make this marriage work.

Thumos - You have posted 5 posts to any other posters single post. Sometimes 3 in a day, back to back. Masters is gunshy, you acknowledged it, then blasted him like he said he was scared of you doing. Scale down just yelling at him what to do and try to show him perspectives. It is probably the better way to show him the way.

Thumos - You have posted 5 posts to any other posters single post. Sometimes 3 in a day, back to back. Masters is gunshy, you acknowledged it, then blasted him like he said he was scared of you doing. Scale down just yelling at him what to do and try to show him perspectives. It is probably the better way to show him the way.

Yeah I’m way over-invested and you’re right, and I had already decided to back off before you posted this. It probably has something to do with my own situation.

I really hope he gets clear of infidelity.

I’m saying the same thing over and over anyway and it’s not getting thru. Hope everyone has a great weekend.

Hi Masters and a good tip for others,

If your WW uses Gmail and you have access to her account (just ask, she may say yes, thinking her tracks were deleted) and you want to see the emails, there is a very good chance that they are still there.

Gmail likes to save everything in about 3 different places so even if she deleted the emails from her send and receive folders there is a 90% chance that they will remain in the "all Mail" folder.

On the left side of the Gmail window scroll to "More" then "All Mail" in there will be the sent, received, spam, junk and trashed emails. To really delete Gmail takes some effort as it is a few different places.

Good luck, and IMO if you want to reconcile you should get as much info as you can so you know what you are forgiving .

then blasted him like he said he was scared of you doing

Not sure I blasted him. I think most of what I've posted has not been of the 2x4 variety but more focused on tangible next steps he can take. In any case, I hope he figures it out one way or the other. These situations are so awful.

As long as they work together, the affair is still on to some extent. She will never totally get over him if she sees him and talks to him for work.

I think you need to get a polygraph to know exactly what you are expected to forgive if you choose R.

Good afternoon,

It's over. We talked last night and as much as I try, I can't get over this lack of respect, lack of everything. I can never trust her again and this was her way out. She wants it to be over, so I'm going to try to get over her and the feelings I had/have for her. I emailed my attorney about meeting as she's meeting with one today. I'm sure they'll spin my anger into something and she'll try to screw me over somehow.

Recommendations for those who have gone through the divorce process? I've spoken to an attorney once, but have no idea if she's good or not. How do I find one that is good and can trust? We're going to get the house ready in the new year to sell and separate everything. 10 years down the drain, at least I got 2 amazing kids out of it. I'm also going to talk to an employment attorney and see if there's anything there.

Time to focus on myself and get healthy. If you have any tips on how to move forward, I'm all ears.

(((masters)))

I am so very sorry that D was the outcome because I know that's ultimately not what you wanted, but I am very happy for you that you are finally getting out of infidelity; in the long term, that is the most important thing.

As for lawyers, my advice would be to visit a few of them to get an idea of different fees and approaches. And I would do that as soon as you can to get the ball rolling. Talk to them about filing a formal separation agreement too.

Moving forward: Are you in IC (sorry, I can't remember if you had previously mentioned)? If not, that would be a good idea. You might look into some IRL support groups as well - they do have divorce support groups in some areas (and I believe some of them are specific for men too). And just breathe. And know that YOU ARE GOING TO BE OK. I know it doesn't feel that way right now, but you really are.

I’m sorry Masters.

I’m glad you’re meeting with an employment law attorney - that’s definitely not one to skip given the situation of her AP being her superior and the VP of HR at the company.

I’ve never been through a divorce and I myself am trying to reconcile with my wife, so I haven’t seen one yet.

You might also ask your divorce attorney about alienation of affection legal action in North Carolina. If you were able to deliver a one-two-three punch of immediate divorce proceeding, an alienation of affection lawsuit against her AP, and an employment law action on your behalf — along with a formal complaint against him as her superior, your actual divorce proceeding might go more smoothly.

But that’s only speculation on my part, and a divorce attorney would definitely know better.

Masters, I am seeing an IC that specializes in betrayal trauma. I highly recommend this specialty. There are probably several in your geographic area. You need at least some IC to process this and get through the next several months.

Take care of yourself and focus on you and your kiddos.

My thoughts about attorneys are this- use specialists if at all possible. They should know all the nuances and how judges generally rule... it can make your life simpler.

Be of a mind to give & take, but not give in to get it over with. What's fair is fair. Strive for joint custody, but for you to have parental custody so you make all the final decisions with respect to kid(s). After all, she seems to make poor choices recently.

I also wanted to comment on suing the company. I recommend it not out of revenge, but a company has to know if the HR manager is targeting female employees for sex. They would want to know as who knows how many potentially serious lawsuits lay ahead. HR managers should be the last people in the world starting affairs with employees.

[This message edited by thatbpguy at 1:38 PM, December 9th (Monday)]

You should also do the OBS the favor of letting her know you’re proceeding with divorce. She is probably being kept in the dark by the AP still, and if your STBXWW is still “ in the fog” and “missing him” etc. it’s only a matter of time before they rekindle the affair, if they haven’t already.

You might also think about and write down the various instances of how your wife’s erratic behavior during this period of time has made it difficult for your kids, or even if you’ve noticed them having behavioral problems because of it. That would be important for your divorce attorney to know so they document it and keep you from getting screwed over by your wife.

And one more time - please consider getting a cheap VAR to carry around in your pocket. Now it’s simply to protect you from trumped up DV charges and the like. When it gets to this stage, WW’s are notorious for setting up BH’s for fake DV charges. Be wary.

a company has to know if the HR manager is targeting female employees for sex. They would want to know as who knows how many potentially serious lawsuits lay ahead. HR managers should be the last people in the world starting affairs with employees.

Agreed. This will also make it much more difficult for them to live out their affair fantasy-land once reality comes crashing in. Again, not for revenge, but to protect your and your life with your kids. Keep in mind that the AP VP of HR has in all likelihood signed documents pledging he understands a policy of not entering into romantic relationships with subordinates bc it exposes the company to quid pro quo power differential sexual harassment claims.

Also, if you make sure to tell the OBS you’re divorcing, she’ll be more alert about her husband. I’m willing to bet he’s not interested in supporting your wife as a new divorcee — and it could be that he’ll backpedal furiously away from your STBXWW, especially if the OBS knows your WW is getting divorced.

Obviously this also hinges on advice from a divorce attorney about her livelihood, although it is unlikely your WW would be terminated from the company.

Masters I would also caution you here - one about the VAR as Thumos recommended. Also, if her AP dumps her (which is entirely probable), she may try coming back and love-bombing you to con you into taking her back. Please don't buy into that should it occur, as it is simply another lie (ask me how I know that).

I will also tell you for me, I filed on 09/10/19. That first month or so completely sucked emotionally, but my life has gotten so much better than I ever would have believed possible 3 months ago. So just be prepared for some suck for the next little while, but just keep your eyes on the prize of getting to a place where your life is calmer and more free of drama!

I'm glad you checked back in, Masters. I was afraid our direct input had put you off. Most of us just want you and other newly betrayed to not have happen to you what has happened to us. Learn from our mistakes, in other words.

I'm sorry it ended like this for you. I think we could see that was a possibility based on her behaviour you related to us.

I think it was Thumos that suggested getting a VAR to carry with you at all times. DV charges are not uncommon. Let the OBS know that you are separating and divorcing. She needs to know. And see an employment lawyer as suggested.

It will be very tough emotionally for a while. Healing takes time. I didn't start to heal until a while after my separation. As suggested, an IC who specializes in betrayal trauma would be a good idea.

So sorry.

Sorry to read your update, Masters. I moved with my first wife so she could fulfil her career dream only to "lose" her to her boss. That sacrifice you thought you were making was actually you just being "weak and unambitious". (Unlike the AP, of course). It's a heck of a point of view to be faced with particularly as you gave up security and success in a family business back in your home town.

A couple of points I learned:

- you may or may not take action within the company against STBXW and AP. (Personally I would simply cos I am a git). However if they become an item, her colleagues will know and her reputation will precede her. She will have to work doubly hard to avoid being seen as only getting somewhere because she's the AP's girlfriend.

- as everyone is telling you, go to an IC but from the perspective of "handling" your anger. In exploring the issue, a good IC builds a picture of who you are as a personality so if "anger issues" are chucked around by your wife, your IC may well be able to provide an expert view. Mine did an excellent job in explaining that she would expect any man who found his wife had cheated, moved onto advertise herself as "looking for fun" on Craigslist and then run up a $100K debt to be "angry" and to have difficulty expressing that calmly.

You will survive and thrive.

Masters, I'm sorry it had to go this way and your WW could not be remorseful or even truthful and transparent but I'm relieved for you that you are getting out of infidelity. You will get through this. You will strive on the other side. The pain is temporary and will start to lessen when you don't have to be face-to-face with your WW every day.

Talk to a couple of lawyers and go with your gut. Look into support calculators for your state and ask yourself what seems fair to you. Go with a lawyer who wants the same thing that you do. Preferably one who is capable of fighting if they need to but isn't over-the-top and vindictive about it. It also might be worth it to talk to your STBXWW about what D would look like and if you agree, go with a more calm and fair lawyer and if you don't agree, get the pit bull on retainer instead.

Do you have friends and/or family to support you? You know it’s 100% on her and there’s nothing to be ashamed of.

Don’t be afraid to post as many time as you like. We have seen it all here and can help no matter what happens next.

It WILL get better. You will soon be a single man who was faithful to his wife and took good care of his family.

She will be a cheater who slept with a COW and destroyed her family for no good reason.

Who has the brightest future?

Hey Masters-

It sucks.

Sounds like your STBXW is a bit like my XW. She checked out and had checked out long before I/You caught on to how bad things were.

Any therapy would have been a waste, our was.

Definitely talk to to an attorney about the work situation. Screwing a fellow employee is common, toying with the spouse's career in some sort of sick power trip deserves consequences...your W won't get fired (they don;t want to be sued), unless she's a superstar her career will level off and her co workers will know why.

Good luck. She was done long ago...

Tell the OBS, your WW will be going hard after her AP then if that fails, she may be back for you.