SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

it has been discussed many times where the WW gave their OM

full sex menu while they had fed their BH from the lo carb,

lo cal, lo fat, lo sugar, sex menu.

for me that answer was to feed their BH from the full sex menu.

this post is not about that.

this post is about what happens after the WW says the sex with

her OM was better, the best ever, etc.

How does the WW and the BH get past this?

Does the BH ignore that his WW willingly accept less

rewarding sex?

Does the BH try to improve his game, and what if cannot?

How does the BH try to improve his game?

Does the WW try to help the BH improve his game?

How to handle physical comparisons where the BH cannot

change by diet or going to the gym?

Does this effort by the WW lead the BH to think that all these

new things WW is teaching her BH his WW learned from

her OM?

What is the adjustment a WW goes from giving up great or

best ever sex having average sex?

[This message edited by oldtruck at 3:17 PM, April 18th (Saturday)]

My H divorced me immediately after D-day so discussions about sex or who is or isn’t “better” never happened, but he knows sex between us, when it used to happen, was lackluster.

Does the BH ignore that his WW willingly accept less

rewarding sex?

This, for us.

What is the adjustment a WW goes from giving up great or best ever sex having average sex?

We stopped having sex. At 9+ years post-D-day to now 10+, it has been over a year without anything but generic peck-like kisses. There is no turning anyone down; he hasn’t initiated in years and I just finally stopped. Ergo, he must be as fine with it as I am.

After we remarried we only ever REALLY had sex to conceive our children, anyway.

[This message edited by Darkness Falls at 4:16 PM, April 18th (Saturday)]

Does the BH think he should consider D?

I’m sorry but if my H EVER said anything like that it would be game over!

She didn’t have any respect or common sense to be discreet and not be brutally honest THE ONE TIME it meant the most to your marriage?

I am so angry 😡 for you I’d like to smack her.

Funny to see this after posting in another thread on the better sex issue.

I'm a BW. My best sexual experiences / partner were not with my WH. I never really talked about it. My WH did once ask me about it (years & years ago) and I was honest. And there were times during the M where I wanted more in the bedroom, which I was honest and candid about. He refused me. And then went and had a decade-long PA (assuming he wasn't already cheating, which I'm not sure about). Doesn't mean sex with my WH was bad... just that I wanted to change things up, get out of the "routine" so to speak. Post dday there was a period when he suddenly wanted to try new things, and I was willing at that time (in retrospect, I believe mostly to try and reclaim my own sexuality in the wake of it all). But that willingness has passed with the months of WH avoiding any of "the work" to rebuild trust or become honest, etc.

What I can say is that at the moment I married him I was willing to sacrifice that mind bending sex for all of the other (what I thought at the time) wonderful things about my WH. Like honesty & good character (about which I was horrifyingly wrong). Being intellectually compatible. A good dad and provider, etc. Those are things I still value more than mind blowing sex.

Darknessfalls,

was your BH happy with the sex before D day?

Was the frequency of the sex enough for you before your D day?

Did the level of sex with your BH change during the PA?

Was the sex with your BH different after D day?

After D day eventually you became the last one to initiate

sex. did your BH accept those offers?

why did your BH stopped having sex with you?

did he do IC?

do you think IC would help your BH get his drive back?

Did you two talk or rug sweep? I think the rest of your lives

without sex is not healthy. worth the time and effort to

restore that part of the marriage. BH can be still feeling

totally emasculated after all these years.

was your BH happy with the sex before D day?

I don’t know.

Was the frequency of the sex enough for you before your D day?

Yes.

Did the level of sex with your BH change during the PA?

No.

Was the sex with your BH different after D day?

We had around 2 weeks of HB after D-day, then I moved out. Two years later, when we started dating again after our divorce, yes, it was very different—I was no longer attracted to him much.

After D day eventually you became the last one to initiate

sex. did your BH accept those offers?

Usually. There were times he wasn’t in the mood.

why did your BH stopped having sex with you?

He didn’t. I stopped having sex with him.

did he do IC?

No, he would never agree to IC or MC.

do you think IC would help your BH get his drive back?

I don’t know.

Did you two talk or rug sweep?

Mostly rugsweep. He is the most conflict avoidant person I have ever met. He’d probably chew his own arm off before he’d talk about the affair again.

I think the rest of your lives

without sex is not healthy. worth the time and effort to

restore that part of the marriage. BH can be still feeling

totally emasculated after all these years.

Oh, I’m not living like this the rest of my life. One day I will find happiness and a healthy relationship with someone else. I would hope for the same with him, but I don’t think he’s interested.

Has a WW ever told her BH that sex was better with her AP if she wanted to R ? How did that turn out ?

Has a WW ever told her BH that sex was better with her AP if she wanted to R ? How did that turn out ?

Those are things I still value more than mind blowing sex.

Yep. I'm a BW, not a CW. While I do have the best sex ever with my H, that is not what I valued most about him. Course, turns out that was probably the only real thing about him. All the other stuff that I valued more was a facade.🤷‍♀️

I think, in general, women value other things more than mind blowing sex. Sorry, guys, I know that's not something you like to hear.

I have a hard time imagining a reconciliation-worthy WS who insists the affair sex was better. Good sex is subjective, and it's hard to imagine a humble and compassionate WS who could look back and view the affair sex with a positive lens.

Am I missing something? Is this a matter of the BS asking specific questions like who was in better shape? I would encourage that BS to explore those feelings . . . are you saying that it was OK for your WS to cheat on you as long as it was with someone inferior? Probably not. Those feelings of inadequacy can be accepted and explored and put to rest.

[This message edited by swmnbc at 9:26 AM, April 19th, 2020 (Sunday)]

Oldtruck, to answer your OP, I've not personally been in that situation, but my imagination tells me that if I, as BH, I would have difficulty performing sexually if my WW told me that the sex she had with the AP while cheating on me was the best sex she had.

Strangely, to me it feels different than dating somebody new and, during pillow talk, they describe a prior lover who was really good in bed.

swmnbc:

I have a hard time imagining a reconciliation-worthy WS who insists the affair sex was better. Good sex is subjective, and it's hard to imagine a humble and compassionate WS who could look back and view the affair sex with a positive lens.

This is an interesting comment.

swmnbc, are you saying that R worthy WSs actually look back at sex with their APs negatively even if they had great sex with their AP during the affair ? Does that negate the great sex they had during the affair ? Does that make it easier for the BS to accept ?

I don't actually believe that my WW had better sex with AP than with me. They had sex 7 times. According to her, all were fairly quick, just her bent over on his couch. She gave him head a couple times before sex, because he "practically shoved it in her mouth". He never went down on her. This is the version of the story I've been getting for years. She claims she didn't even really like having sex with him, she was holding on to the emotional/mental affair they were having prior to when he allegedly "made his move". It's possible she's lying, but at this point I have just accepted that I'll never know the full truth.

Ever since our kids were born, her libido has diminished. Sex with her is very clinical and mechanical. The odd thing is, I think she prefers it this way. She doesn't want foreplay. I am forbidden to go down on her, for reasons unknown. She doesn't want anything extra or exciting, just very basic PIV. BJ's occur sparingly, usually reserved for special occasions like my birthdays or Christmas. I have accepted that this is just the way my sex life is going to be as long as I am with her. The only way it will change is if she suddenly gets her libido back, and wants to direct that sexual energy at me instead of somebody else. Not gonna hold my breath.

If I found out that she had the best sex of her life with AP, and that she's been lying to me this whole time, I'd be gone. SO FAST! If I found out they had passionate, porn star level sex... I'd be done. I would not get over that. That would just be too big of a shit sandwich for me to swallow. I would become a weekend Dad and lose half or more of my money/assets if I that's what it took, but I would not put up with that for one more day than I had to! As a BH, I could never, ever come back from that.

[This message edited by Fenderguy at 1:49 PM, April 19th (Sunday)]

If I eat the most delicious, gloriously decadent, rich and luxurious, toe curling and moaning level of enjoyment of food and it gives me food poisoning, I’m probably not going to rate that meal as the best I ever had.

Context matters.

I’m not terribly interested in how my husband rated things when he was being his literal worst. At that moment he was a stupid person. Stupid people often really truly enjoy and prefer things that are subpar on many levels.

(Smart people don’t risk life and limb (via STDs) for sex, no matter how many degrees they have or how many times they have proven they can be smart. Being smart is like being a good person - it is indicated purely on what you do. When a person is in an affair they are neither good nor smart - or loving or kind or generous etc.)

Anyone who is looking back on the dish that had them puking their guts out for an extended time fondly with a wry smile of how good it tasted pre puking, is not a human I’m willing to hang out with YMMV

[This message edited by strugglebus at 2:06 PM, April 19th (Sunday)]

swmnbc, are you saying that R worthy WSs actually look back at sex with their APs negatively even if they had great sex with their AP during the affair ? Does that negate the great sex they had during the affair ? Does that make it easier for the BS to accept ?

Yes, precisely, as strugglebus explained it so eloquently.

TBH I did not have a hard time with the thought that my husband had "great" sex with the OW. I thought, well, sex is fun. Humans like sex. I'm sure it was fun and exciting in the moment. I'm sure it was also guilt-inducing and awkward and maybe, since it was so new, so-so. But I know that I have great sex so I don't care to compare myself with anyone else. The issue is that my husband risked my health and kept me trapped in a dysfunctional and abusive relationship by keeping me from realizing the truth. He's free to go have mediocre or terrible or great sex with someone else as long as I have the truth of my life.

It's never a competition between the AP and the spouse. I like to root for other humans and I hope they all have healthy and fulfilling relationships. My only concern is whether the relationship I'm currently choosing to have is healthy and fulfilling. A cheater, by definition, cannot offer that to me. That's my focus . . . what he can offer me. Not what he offered OW or she offered him. Those are irrelevant because it's just a fact that there are plenty of other people out there we could be happily partnered with. The existence of another such person is no concern of mine unless my partner decides harming me is OK. Do I feel better if my husband cheated with someone inferior to me who was bad at sex? Well, then I worry that not only is a dirty cheater, but he has bad taste and low standards as well. He can't win. An affair is an affair . . . two broken people getting off on keeping an innocent third party in the dark. I can never be envious of that or threatened by it.

are you saying that R worthy WSs actually look back at sex with their APs negatively even if they had great sex with their AP during the affair ?

Yes.

I love what strugglebus and swmnbc have said. A CP who looks back on A sex as the best ever is not R material.

i can see a WW saying the affair sex was good.

after D day i can see a WW saying that the sex she enjoyed was

not worth the price she now has to pay now. for all the damage

she did and the monumental work that will have to be done for

years to repair the damage, and there always will be the scar to

be a reminder. we can forgive but not forget because of the

triggers.

two separate thoughts.

It's the totality of the man, not the totality of the sex. I'm being practical here, and affairs are anything but. Nonetheless, my statement is no less true for what it's worth.

We have had successfully reconciled WWs here admit that their affair sex was better.

If I eat the most delicious, gloriously decadent, rich and luxurious, toe curling and moaning level of enjoyment of food and it gives me food poisoning, I’m probably not going to rate that meal as the best I ever had.

I'd agree with this comment wholeheartedly.

In my case, my FWS betrayed me with a guy who would fuck her anywhere, our house in our bed with all 4 of our kids down the short hallway watching TV, his house in their bed, in our garage, in the shop where he worked after hours, in a park in the middle of the day with families around outside of the vehicle, in someone else's house where he was doing some work when they weren't home, in the woods at a wildlife preserve, and in the woods on someone else's property, she had sex on the ground in front of our youngest child in a car seat (very young child who has no memory of this thankfully).

Wild sex. Crazy sex. Risky sex. Unprotected sex. Drunk sex. Morning after pill necessary sex...yes the condoms in the drawer were for me, not for the AP who didn't need them apparently despite not having had a vasectomy.

How can anyone compete with that?

You don't.

My FWS would hardly fuck me in our bedroom, and it had to be dark and the blinds had to be drawn, the kids had to be sleeping, it was like she was afraid our parents would catch us. We could go months between sexual activity. She had so many hangups about sex that I was baffled, after all she had way more sexual experience than I did coming into our marriage and talked about how much she loved sex when we were dating. Yet, during dating and marriage, I discovered that I had way more sex drive, while she had way more partners, and it was all "nonsense sex", by which I mean it was rather unfulfilling. She had never had an orgasm, never, not once, with any partner, or on her own, including me, till long after we were married, and I'm the one who helped her work through it. I wouldn't have been able to do that if I had not had professional knowledge along those lines.

As it happens, in my marriage, I was nearly to the point of asking for a divorce because after 18 years of trying, working with my FWS, and slowly getting older, and feeling unwanted sexually (by my spouse but then being periodically hit on by other attractive women, despite them knowing I was married, which just left me being really fucking irritated because I didn't understand why my spouse wasn't sexually interested in me despite telling me that there was "nothing wrong"), after all I was the one who basically painstakingly helped her "get there" orgasm wise, this led to the confession and D-day.

Which eventually led to a real sex life in our marriage, something I had been trying to achieve for two decades.

Good sex, great sex, fulfilling sex, comes from two partners working together to give/help each other have a pleasurable experience.

If the two people involved work at that, together, over time they become "best partners". If both partners are not invested in doing so, then it will not happen. It took my FWS a long time to understand that, and she is attractive, educated, intelligent, and from a very liberal background. However, no insult intended, she had the sexual maturity of teenager at 40 years of age for a variety of reasons.

Affair sex is something else, and not just in my FWS's affair.

If a FWS says that they prefer the affair sex, and thinks it was the best sex they have ever had, I'd suggest they get IC and figure out why they can't achieve better in their marriage, with a partner that they have way more time to figure things out with.

I agree with GMC94, statement copied below, I had the same experience. I didn't intentionally "sacrifice", but I thought over time we would be able to work it out (turns out we did but it took going through Hell to do so).

What I can say is that at the moment I married him I was willing to sacrifice that mind bending sex for all of the other (what I thought at the time) wonderful things about my WH. Like honesty & good character (about which I was horrifyingly wrong). Being intellectually compatible. A good dad and provider, etc. Those are things I still value more than mind blowing sex.