SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

I agree with BSR and Carissima. How is this not cheating, exactly?

IMO, if he had just made the account, looked around, and deleted it, it would be poor behavior but not cheating. It's the fact that he spent hours (or days?) talking to an OW, sharing fantasies and pictures, that makes it an EA. That's cheating even if he didn't meet up with her for sex and I'd find it difficult to believe that anyone who said otherwise would not agree had a WS been doing it.

For those who don't consider this cheating I wonder if that would be the same if it was a wayward writing on here about how they resisted temptation.

I had the same question, along with:

If you discovered your spouse had signed up with Ashley Madison, made a local contact, sexted them while sitting across from you at the kitchen table, and gone online to rhapsodize about how hot and validating it all was -- would you say, "The important point is that you didn't actually fuck anyone. Congratulations on maintaining your integrity?"

If a new BS arrived here saying their spouse did those same things, would you respond, "Well, first let's acknowledge that they didn't actually cheat?"

There's a big difference between arguing that you think an RA is somehow justifiable and arguing that OP's actions aren't "real" infidelity. I disagree with the former position, but the latter makes no sense to me at all.

He didn't cheat??

Let's recap.

He joined a dating site known to cater to married people looking for an affair.

He found a woman he finds very attractive,and began conversing with her. He talked about his marital problems with her. He looked forward to her messages, checking his phone every few minutes. It got "real." They were texting at 3am. She says she wants to fuck him. So clearly they weren't shooting the shit about the weather. He was sexting this woman.

He also has no remorse for joining a dating site catering to married people.(IIRC, men have to pay to join this site)He considers what he did to be flirting. This went way beyond flirting, but he is minimizing his actions. Sound wayward yet? He also doesn't consider how her husband would feel. Oh, wait. She says she told him she wants a divorce. Right. Cheaters don't lie, we all know that

But he didn't cheat?

How so?

Because he didn't have sex?

If your wife did what he did, you would be cool with it?

[This message edited by HellFire at 9:03 AM, September 21st (Monday)]

If you discovered your spouse had signed up with Ashley Madison, made a local contact, sexted them while sitting across from you at the kitchen table, and gone online to rhapsodize about how hot and validating it all was -- would you say, "The important point is that you didn't actually fuck anyone. Congratulations on maintaining your integrity?"

Cut right through it. Thank you BSR

I want to add that I don’t consider myself holier than thou. We are all like sheep led astray.

I’ve mentioned before that I travel for work and for whatever reason my particular line of work puts me in contact with attractive, smart women (and I’m a sucker for smart women). There have been more than a few times when these women have sent signals. I struggled with feeling less attractive after my WW’s affair but objectively I knew that wasn’t the case.

Every single time a woman starts to flirt heavily I’ve done this thought process:

-if she’s single and we have a ONS how will I feel in the morning? Better or worse?

-if she’s single and we establish a connection beyond a ONS and then I hurt her because I’m still trying to reconcile, how will I feel about that? Better or worse?

-And what about my reconciliation attempt? It will just make that more difficult.

-if she’s married or has a boyfriend and we have a ONS, how will I feel about doing that to another faithful married man or boyfriend? To bring the same horrific pain into his life? How could I, knowing what I know, having experienced what I’ve experienced?

And so every time I bow out of the dinner or social function and go back to my hotel or Airbnb. Every time. I’m not going to lie: it has in the past felt like a Finger Trap and made me feel like a caged animal. But doing that thought process has given me clarity every single time.

I would imagine every single betrayed spouse thinks about a revenge affair. Thinks about it many times.

I hope this is helpful to others who might be struggling.

Don’t do it. Head held high, values intact is the best way forward.

[This message edited by Thumos at 10:10 AM, September 21st (Monday)]

FU,

I understand your need for revenge, although my target is more the OMs.

It's even a bit of a thrill turning down women or having to work at keeping them at a distance.

But I think having a revenge affair with someone is like consoling yourself about being fat with a 10 lb bag of Costco peanut butter cups.

Seeing a prostitute is not better either, as you are contributing to a form of slavery.

Are you going to confess to your WW?

I read your post and scratched my head.

You are upset with your wife's affair? Yet, your description of how the responses you received on the Ashley Madison website, and how wonderful they apparently made you feel, seems to support your own wife's affair.

She experienced similar feelings and cheated. Now you are jonesing for the same feelings. Congratulations! Your choices seem to fall in life with the choices your wife made and probably for the exact same reasons.

You are a cheater as well. As others have pointed out, you know the misery of being a BS and yet you are willing for your own selfish reasons to make other innocent parties experience the same thing.

Why not get divorced, find a woman of your own (unmarried) and live a life of positive character, infidelity free. Instead you seem top have chosen Free Infidelity (minus the fee you pay to Ashley Madison (the pimp)).

Fug,

I have never despised my WW more.

Then why, why??? continue this charade...

Fugly, this 'pretty lady' that was giving you the ego kibbles is NO BETTER THAN YOUR CHEATING WIFE. They are the SAME person.

Was it Einstein who said that crazy = doing the same actions over and over and expecting a different result? Yeah, that's what this is.

If you're done with your M, then rip the fucking band-aid off and be done and file. Don't do this to yourself or your family living half-in/half-out and pulling toxic RA shit. All that will do is prolong your pain and cause pain to everyone around you. Nothing you ever did justifies your ww cheating on you, but the sauce is for the gander too - nothing she has done justifies you doing this shit to another family. And fwiw, IMHO you have had a revenge affair now, whether you consummated it or not.

ETA - I am in no way saying that I don't get wanting to hurt your ww back. I totally get that - I think most BS's probably understand that feeling. But it is not worth the shit it would add to that shit sandwich you are already trying to choke down. Just my 0.02.

[This message edited by EllieKMAS at 11:28 AM, September 21st (Monday)]

A cooler head is now prevailing. But that doesnt mean that damage has been done. Honestly I hate myself for simply flirting and testing the waters. I let her know about the account, and my own temptation.

"You either survive infidelity, or let it break you". This has very clearly broken me. I am no better than the AP who looked me in the eyes and gave me encouragement all the meanwhile bouncing my wife.

I fell off the wagon after 16 months of sobriety. Opened an account, flirted, had the temptation. In a way, I think this was my way of exiting this relationship.

I just want to stop feeling this way. I am in constant pain, and know that the first steps need to be me, bettering myself. I dont even know who I am at this point.

Fugly, I felt that way too for a while after dday - like my entire existence was an illusion. I think that's pretty normal.

I think that it is really important to give yourself room to:

A) really think hard about what you want YOUR life to be. Not in terms of marriage etc, but in terms of YOU. What do you want? And sometimes, that takes a lot of thinking about to land on.

B) Give yourself the space to grieve. Whether you stay together or split, the marriage died. And there is a grieving process that you have to go through to really get to a place of peace about that. I know for me for a while, I was so impatient with myself to 'get better' that I kinda choked down the grief. But once I really allowed it to be and sat with it, it got easier to handle. And I am D'd for almost a year, and frankly I still have some bad days, and that's okay.

C) Lastly, really spend some time figuring out if the A was just a deal-breaker. I know for me, that took a while for me to admit to myself, but it was. And if it was for you too, there is no shame in walking away. No matter how much history or time or family or anything else, you do not have to martyr yourself for your M.

i have read countless stories where an RA never healed

anything. they only caused more pain. made recovery harder

and longer.

I'm glad you told her, Fugly. That's a major step towards reclaiming your integrity, and one that too many of us have tried to avoid though self-justification and blameshifting.

I will still challenge you that a conversation that starts on an infidelity promotion website, and gets all the way to "I want to jump your bones right now, here's my address," can't really be characterized as flirting.

[This message edited by BraveSirRobin at 12:51 PM, September 21st (Monday)]

Honestly I hate myself for simply flirting and testing the waters. I let her know about the account, and my own temptation.

Thank you for this .

This is HARD. It seems to be harder for BH's to R with their WW's...especially when the mind movies won't stop. I don't know of any BS who hasn't thought about an RA. Thankfully the MH's on here help to show us that this won't help to alleviate any pain.

I was looking for ANY kind of way to get JUSTICE. There is NOTHING that can bring justice for what my H did. But HOW could I keep my sanity?

MY answer was mercy . My H can never make amends for this horrific trauma he caused on my psyche. But I CAN do something to HEAL. Giving mercy...or forgiveness...doesn't mean I forget. But it means that I cut that albatross away from my neck .

The next thing I did was adapt. I was saying the Serenity Prayer over and over...and over again!! I knew I needed to ACCEPT what happened in order to get serenity. But it just wouldn't happen . One day I saw the word adapt...and it was an AHA moment for me! We ALL adapt to our surroundings...and those that don't...die. I certainly didn't want to die!!! I don't ever HAVE to accept what my H did...but I could easily adapt to the marriage I had after infidelity. So...I adapted . I will NEVER have the monogamous marriage that I dreamed of...but I could have the BEST marriage I dreamed of...despite the A .

These are a few of MY ways to cope with what happened. You may have to find YOUR ways. But I guarantee you Dear Sir...you CAN heal . You did something you aren't proud of. You seemed to have learned that THIS path would not be the best path for you. Now you can work on finding another path that will!

What helped me with this was thinking about what I WANTED my LIFE to be . I decided that I wanted a HAPPY and HEALTHY marriage with a LOVING and FAITHFUL spouse...who more than anything...gave me RESPECT. I told my H about my PLAN...and said that he didn't have to agree with this if he didn't want to. But I would find someone who did!! Thankfully my H decided he liked this PLAN too...and we are now walking this path together . Guess what I found out along this path? It wasn't happiness I wanted...it was PEACE . Of course...I didn't find that out until after I chose my username for this site !!!

So start your new path by asking yourself...what do you want? Let it go all over the place . Do you want to travel? To feel happy? Live in a different state? More communication? Maybe a new house? Whatever it is...put it down on your list . Making this list is almost a guarantee that it will get you out of a negative mindset and into a more positive one. Then you can tweak it to be more closer to what you envision .

I appreciate you starting this thread . You reached out instead of acting on your pain...and it looks like you SAVED yourself from a lifetime of regret...like my H is dealing with now. GOOD for you !!!

I just want to stop feeling this way. I am in constant pain, and know that the first steps need to be me, bettering myself. I dont even know who I am at this point.

Focus on you and your healing. It's a choice, you know, healing. We have to choose one thing at a time, one day at a time, and we must do so, I believe, mindful as to whether such decisions are healthy.

You wondered how cheaply those ego kibbles could be purchased and now you know that it has cost you more than you bargained for.

Is it infidelity? Yes. You took steps down Infidelity Lane. How far you travelled is less relevant, in my opinion, than starting that journey.

Don't beat yourself up too badly, brother. You looked down that lane and saw where it lead, made an about-face, and took responsibility for your actions... proof that "I am human, and I think nothing human is alien to me."

Now, of course, comes the hard part. Why did you think "testing the waters" would help you to heal?