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Cheating as a lifestyle?

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Rideitout ( member #58849) posted at 2:56 PM on Thursday, October 29th, 2020

No no no, my XWH says they force you to have sex with them and pay them. That's their nefarious game. You'll just be visiting a friend and there they are, forcing you to have sex and getting into your wallet. It's a sad sad tale.

Wow, that takes gall. So, he's actually a victim, sounds like it was basically a sexual assault to me.

I guess, thank goodness, no prostitute has ever jumped me before, attacked me with their vagina, then demanded payment.

How stupid does he think other people are to even try to pitch this story?

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DevastatedDee ( member #59873) posted at 3:00 PM on Thursday, October 29th, 2020

I was almost impressed with him having the gall to tell that lie, ha ha ha. You men just need to be careful walking around living your lives. You never know when prostitutes will come leaping out of the shadows to fuck and rob you. It has to be scary.

DDay: 06/07/2017
MH - RA on DDay.
Divorced a serial cheater (prostitutes and lord only knows who and what else).

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siracha ( member #75132) posted at 3:24 PM on Thursday, October 29th, 2020

Lol .. i think this is an extension of other vagina envy thoughts ive read recently. It all makes sense if you start out with the first law of humanity “no man can resist any vagina” .

I always thought the eye of saron was a very obvious metaphor ; who doesnt love LOTR and as time goes I see Tolkein was even more of a prophet than i originally thought.

[This message edited by siracha at 9:37 AM, October 29th (Thursday)]

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hikingout ( member #59504) posted at 3:57 PM on Thursday, October 29th, 2020

One of the things that I don't think a lot of cheaters think about, yes, this is your "first time" cheating, it is his/hers? In my wife's case, it wasn't, his wife caught him 2X before (unbeknownst to my wife, of course). He was a "hobbyist", and my wife was his latest "project". The thing people need to think about, if you're in an affair and not the hobbyist, there's a good chance your AP is. Affairs don't, despite much crap we read, "just happen". In fact, it takes a lot of work, often from the "hobbyist" to make it happen. I've been married for 10 years, I'm handsome, I'm wealthy, and I've had 0 women proposition me for an A. Now, some of that is simply distancing from women, but, I have to believe it's really rare for it to happen that way, I'd have to pursue an A, just like I'd have to pursue a prostitute if I wanted the "monger" experience. They don't jump out in a dark alley and attack you with their boobs!

I am going to go out on a limb here and say that they sense your boundaries. By all accounts my H's horse-face skank for sure orchestrated.

Prior to that I might have kind of nodded a bit at what you are saying. As you know, my A and your wifes A have a lot of similiarities. Nowhere in my imagination would I have actively worked to have an affair, or put out an ad or joined a site. But, that doesn't mean there aren't a lot of women who don't.

I can see where you are going with the breakdown of marriages. However, I think the opposite is true. I know a lot of young couples because of my kids age and the fact they are also in various stages of getting married. They give me a lot of hope. I think regardless of the gutter our world has become, the stability of family and having meaningful relationships is on the short list of basic human tendencies and needs. I think we are seeing a resurgence of morals and a completely different approach to marriage in this new generation. They are criticized a lot for their sensitivities and political stances but the principles they have in that arena will suit them well in marriage. They have their shit together and already understand concepts that I have just spent a lot of time learning.

[This message edited by hikingout at 9:58 AM, October 29th (Thursday)]

8 years of hard work - WS and BS - Reconciled

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Rideitout ( member #58849) posted at 4:21 PM on Thursday, October 29th, 2020

I know a lot of young couples because of my kids age and the fact they are also in various stages of getting married.

I hope your right, but the statistics don't look promising. Just Google "Marriage is a dying institution" and you'll see what I mean. Very interestingly, it's only dying in some socioeconomic groups, the well off/rich are still basically following the "old model", it's just that everyone below that isn't anymore. Age of marriage is increasing, divorce is rampant, as is cheating. Can it change? Of course it can, but, as it sits today, I'm not hopeful; we're pushing in the other direction; weakening marriage rather than strengthening it.

You men just need to be careful walking around living your lives. You never know when prostitutes will come leaping out of the shadows to fuck and rob you. It has to be scary.

Yeah, absolutely terrifying. :)

It all makes sense if you start out with the first law of humanity “no man can resist any vagina” .

Probably more true than not. Make it easy enough, and the woman attractive enough, and, while there certainly are some who can, many cannot. Why do you think prostitution is illegal? Sure isn't to "protect women" (although that's become the common refrain now, it's been illegal for FAR longer than anyone cared much for protecting women). It's illegal primarily because, if it's wildly available and socially acceptable, well, men have a lot of trouble with it, and the women who love those men have a lot of trouble dealing with the repercussions of it. The more socially acceptable and available prostitution is, the fewer marriages, the fewer children born, etc. Now, this isn't to, FOR A MOMENT, say that men "cannot resist" the eye of Sauron, of course they can. But keep testing it, keep fiddling with "the one ring to rule them all" and well, eventually a lot of people will put it on. And net result, it's bad for society.

As you know, my A and your wifes A have a lot of similiarities. Nowhere in my imagination would I have actively worked to have an affair, or put out an ad or joined a site. But, that doesn't mean there aren't a lot of women who don't.

I guess, although it seems a little hard to fathom. I mean, how hard would it be for you to find an AP today? How much "work" would it take? A woman who sets in her mind "I want to have an A" likely won't take more than a few hours before she's, in fact, having an A. It's like of like hunting bear while standing in a zoo, pick up the gun, point, pull trigger, dead bear. Not a whole lot of "work" required.

Do some women? I'm sure they do, they want a very specific type of AP, or live in a very rural area where there are very little/no options where it won't get back to the H, want a particular kink fulfilled, etc. But if you're just shooting for your run of the mill "roll in the hay" type A, well, at least for my W, that's about as available to her as air is to me. The only comparison I can make is stepping into a cathouse with a briefcase full of cash, anything you want, for the asking with any woman you see there. That's basically my W's day to day experience, which, of course, is very, very different than my own.

Also, of note, while NSA sex is on abundant offer to my W, commitment/love/etc is NOT at all. For every 100 guys who would line up to sleep with her, very few have much/any interest in a serious relationship, particularly if all 100 of those guys are already married. That's the paradox, the thing she proports to want from an A is nearly unavailable in an A, where the thing she got from the A, well, is freely available anywhere she wants it, at any time she wants it and holds it has little/no value for her.

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hikingout ( member #59504) posted at 4:32 PM on Thursday, October 29th, 2020

Maybe not hard if you lied and said you weren't married. Believe it or not, I don't think all guys would knowingly fuck someone else's wife. And, for the record I think a lot of guys would have an easier time for someone to cheat with if they also lied about being married as well. Some do that because they found the path to least resistance is that way.

Once, when I was still dating, I met this really attractive guy that I really liked a lot. On the third date, we were going to watch a movie at his apt. I took one look at the decorations, and the one clue he dropped by asking me if I had ever cheated on anyone and got the fuck out of dodge. Single people have a larger dating pool than married people, and I wasn't going any further with that ass. I think when you get a single woman interested in a married man, they are more interested in getting the lifestyle the wife has than the man itself.

Notice in the majority of cases we see in this site it's two married people. And that's because there is already some inherent things there that make it easier. One being the other one has as much to loose as you do. Another the person has about the same amount of resistance morally to cheating.

8 years of hard work - WS and BS - Reconciled

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siracha ( member #75132) posted at 4:43 PM on Thursday, October 29th, 2020

Rideitout

i hear you , noone can or even needs to resist someone who is attractive to them when there is genuinely no “cost” ( including moral emotional physical economic) to it . The issue is the belief that vagina will always make a man compromise everything else 100 percent of the time .. and get this ... against his own will! What ?

[This message edited by siracha at 10:51 AM, October 29th (Thursday)]

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Rideitout ( member #58849) posted at 4:55 PM on Thursday, October 29th, 2020

The issue is the belief that vagina will always make a man compromise everything else 100 percent of the time .. and get this ... against his own will! What ?

Against their own will? Absolutely not. 100% of the time? No, I don't believe that either.

But, the best way I think is imagine if you were tasked with guarding a safe that had 100M dollars in it. Imagine if your that guard and you learn that nobody beyond you even has the keys to the safe. Nobody will ever check, there's no audit, there's nobody but you even opening the door to look inside. Finally, imagine your paid 25K/yr as the guard.

Now, given that criteria, how many people are going to help themselves? 100%? No. 0%? No. A very high percentage? Yes, I'd bet my life on that. In fact, that's why you NEVER have setups like that in corporate finance (a "safe" with nobody else looking in) because it's almost a guarantee that people will take that money, especially if they feel they "need" or "deserve" it, but even if they are paid 50M a year, a lot of people will STILL steal when it's "easy enough".

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siracha ( member #75132) posted at 6:33 PM on Thursday, October 29th, 2020

Very interesting analogy and i agree but with one caveat .sex isnt the 100 million dollars asset that trumps everything else i think a persons integrity or LTR is the prime asset for most people of both genders . There would be zero LTR s if men werent hard wired soft wired socialized conditioned etc etc to see sex as a lesser objective just as women do . Agreed?

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DevastatedDee ( member #59873) posted at 6:36 PM on Thursday, October 29th, 2020

Well yeah, I mean, I have never asked a man to marry me. I've not been the one to move dating from casual to exclusive and serious. So men do kinda seem to be interested in love and committment and such.

DDay: 06/07/2017
MH - RA on DDay.
Divorced a serial cheater (prostitutes and lord only knows who and what else).

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newlife03 ( member #56527) posted at 6:39 PM on Thursday, October 29th, 2020

When there are Ashley Madison commercials on TV I want to puke. I haven't actually seen one in a while but I'm mostly into Netflix or my own recordings these days.

There used to be a website for cheating women but I can't remember the link anymore. In my earlier days as a BW I went on that site as a troll but got caught (enter the hand slapping emoji).

Some will always believe it's acceptable behavior, probably until it happens to them.

Me - 50
Kids 25, 22, 18
1st DDay in 2006, 2nd in 2007
D in 2009
Happily Committed to SO since 2011

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 landclark (original poster member #70659) posted at 6:50 PM on Thursday, October 29th, 2020

I feel like this thread is getting off track a bit. lol

I haven't read through all the comments yet, but the hooker assaulting men comments are pretty funny!

Me: BW Him: WH (GuiltAndShame) Dday 05/19/19 TT through AugustOne child together, 3 stepchildrenTogether 13.5 years, married 12.5

First EA 4 months into marriage. Last ended 05/19/19. *ETA, contd an ea after dday for 2 yrs.

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siracha ( member #75132) posted at 6:50 PM on Thursday, October 29th, 2020

Great point Dee , i dont see women buying men super expensive diamond rings in return for lifelong monogamy .

Sorrryy !! These Tjs are my achilles heel !

[This message edited by siracha at 12:52 PM, October 29th (Thursday)]

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Oldwounds ( member #54486) posted at 10:30 PM on Thursday, October 29th, 2020

It seems my wife's AP cheated as a part of his life or lifestyle for years until he was caught.

AP for my wife was a neighbor, co-worker, they were family friends for a while. He was 7-years older than my wife and tried to take the "I would never do this, but YOU'RE SO SPECIAL, I'm daring to cross this line for you!"

As it turned out, my wife wasn't his first infidelity.

To be fair, he actually asked a series of questions to make sure she wouldn't leave her marriage to chase him. He kept checking that over time.

Eventually, after dumping my wife hard, he returned a couple years later to apologize for being so harsh and hoped to get things going again. It's the first and only time my wife turned him away.

Seven years later, she got the 12-step apology call as he was going with the SA claim. I think some people are SA, and it's real, but I think for some people it's one more way to avoid responsibility for their choices.

In all, this particular AP kept infidelity in his life for as long as he could -- about 20-years before he got caught, found religion and the 12-step program.

[This message edited by Oldwounds at 4:31 PM, October 29th (Thursday)]

Married 36+ years, together 41+ years
Two awesome adult sons.
Dday 6/16 4-year LTA Survived.
M Restored
"It is better to conquer our grief than to deceive it." — Seneca

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20yrsagoBS ( member #55272) posted at 10:39 PM on Thursday, October 29th, 2020

For serial cheaters, I do believe it’s a lifestyle choice.

WH would deny it, but then why the multiple APs? It wasn’t them clamoring for attention from him, it was him driving the momentum

BW, 54 WH 53 When you lie down with dogs, you wake up with fleas

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 landclark (original poster member #70659) posted at 4:01 AM on Friday, October 30th, 2020

WH would deny it, but then why the multiple APs? It wasn’t them clamoring for attention from him, it was him driving the momentum

I know in once case, the EA AP definitely pursued him. She thought he would make a good sugar daddy. When she realized he was broke, she dropped him like a hot turd.

I agree on the surface for serial cheater, the word choice is accurate, but I also think it’s a word choice that attempts to minimize what is happening. To support the “I deserve to be happy” crap. So they can say “well, not everybody understands this lifestyle”, and pushing off the responsibility for what they’re doing.

Now for other legitimate lifestyles (healthy, poly, etc.), it’s not being used as a way to sidestep judgment. So there’s a big difference there.

Me: BW Him: WH (GuiltAndShame) Dday 05/19/19 TT through AugustOne child together, 3 stepchildrenTogether 13.5 years, married 12.5

First EA 4 months into marriage. Last ended 05/19/19. *ETA, contd an ea after dday for 2 yrs.

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 landclark (original poster member #70659) posted at 4:03 AM on Friday, October 30th, 2020

Sorrryy !! These Tjs are my achilles heel !

It was a good one, so it’s all good. Lol

Me: BW Him: WH (GuiltAndShame) Dday 05/19/19 TT through AugustOne child together, 3 stepchildrenTogether 13.5 years, married 12.5

First EA 4 months into marriage. Last ended 05/19/19. *ETA, contd an ea after dday for 2 yrs.

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pureheartkit ( member #62345) posted at 8:43 PM on Friday, October 30th, 2020

Going with the automation forecast, yes, people will need something to do. Hopefully its not going to be a time of need. We can find things for people to do.

Right now everyone could work 30 hours a week and we could get to 20 with some effort. Then say the remaining time you do public service that enriches the community and learn new things or practice the arts, doing some mental or spiritual growth. Everybody gets 8 hours of sleep, basic medical and a safe place to live. It means we share some things. Buying everything isn't the focus anymore.

We treat everyone decently and reject things that destroy us as human beings.

I've been to that cheating subreddit. Fine den of wolves. Teaching each other to perfect lies and ways to hide. They don't care who they ruin as long as they get theirs.

If we give in to this mentality, were finished. The time has come to choose. We need to choose what builds us up. We know we are able with our amazing brains to comprehend this. The present is failing us but the future can be whatever we choose. The ideas are out there.

Greed and selfishness. We have to beat it. Then we can have a golden age. Technology is our friend if we can use it fairly.

It isn't an easy transition. I see it putting incredible pressures on the young. They can't get started so they wait to start families. Then they have huge debt. It doesn't have to be like that.

We choose.

Thank you everyone for your wisdom and healing.

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