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Many BS want to compare how they measured up to their WS

AP when it came to affair sex verses their married sex life.

I my mind it is extremely hard for a WS to tell their BS that

their OM was better in bed. Specially when the WS is trying

to recover their marriage.

So that makes it hard to believe the WS when they say sex with

the AP was bad, the same, BS is just as good as the AP, felt

physically just as good as with the BS but the thought of

behaving bad, acting risky, made them feel at the time that

sex with the AP was better.

All of those statements make it appear that the WS is just

saying things do do damage control.

WS is asked was the sex with the AP better what do they

mean when the WS answers that the sex was not better just

different?

[This message edited by oldtruck at 8:13 PM, January 18th (Monday)]

My WS described it as sex. That “even bad sex is good”

Were we married to the same person old truck? Or is "it was just different" on page 73 of the cheater handbook?

And I guess it was different in my case...me being a monagomous spouse who did not have something like 100 sexual partners that year and who did not fly to hookup with married strangers in hotels and cybersex pics of myself to strangers all over the world (we'll fill in the blank here)..

if that is what he meant by different I am good with that description.

My WW described it as “full of fear and anxiety”. Hard to enjoy, but it was the price of admission to keep his attention.

I had sex with other partners before marriage. It's not hard for me to understand the explanation of "different". That said, it doesn't make sense to me why people get so hung up on whether their cheating spouse's sexual experience with an AP was "better" or "worse". Either way, the WS has rejected what s/he had at home in favor of what the AP is offering, even if that rejection was a temporary one. "Better", "worse", or "different" won't change what happened. Whether it was for a day, a week, a year, or forever, the abandonment HAPPENED and in that space of time, the AP was preferred. I can't speak for anyone else, but IMHO, THAT's the source of the pain and where the focus should be.

oldtruck

from another old guy -

The question that will never have a good answer for the asking person

"Any Orgasm" is good sex (most males) even if parts start dropping off later. I spent time in USN watching sailors go to sick bay after nights "on the town."

Once had a GF (FWB) who *loved* her orgasms. Kissing not part of the get together.

She was known to be discreet but "easy" when the right stud showed up. I just happened to be an in between (as I later learned) - and I never met another quite like her.

I did have several GFs (not proud to say some married) that *loved* the orgasm. I was attractive enough at the time. And was known to be a "player" but never discussed details w/anyone. Maybe they had a bit of trust?

So, "was it better" - I don't think so. What I think is it was AVAILABLE. No or little emotion - just plain fun in the sack.

As a BS - WW claims we "never slept together" - (aka fucked) - well you know the duck metaphor.

It is a wonderful memory to carry for the rest of your life.

"Was it better?" - nah - just Different, new, taboo violation -

A fleshy tube meets a wet hole - just how different can that be? Answer - it is the wrapper it comes with -

This is a very hard question to answer.

I generally had better sex with women I loved than women I did not love but this was not always true.

I generally had better sex with women I was very attracted to but that was not always true.

I generally had better sex with women who were very open-minded and willing to do anything and everything but that is not always true.

I generally had better sex with women who were very enthusiastic to have sex with me but that was not always true.

I generally had better sex with women who had better skills than women who did not have better skills but that was not always true.

I generally had better sex with women whose body fit better with mine and had better coital movements that synched with mine.

I think when the WS says the sex was different they mean the categories of the sex were variable but I don't know since I am not a cheater.

[This message edited by Username123 at 9:53 PM, January 18th (Monday)]

I was trying to form a similar answer on another thread and I couldn't seem to come up with anything that didn't make me sound like a complete asshole. I'm a little nervous to continue tbh..

My ex didn't flat-out ask if it was better, he did draw comparisons and asked about things like size difference, acts, positions, frequency. I was honest about those things and would have been if he asked if the AP was better.

Was the AP better? Well it wasn't bad. BH and I, our sex life started out just as thrilling and whatnot, then it became something that felt more like maintenance. It wasn't his fault or mine I suppose, we both fell into the ol' tried and true method.

So at the time my affair was happening compared to the current status with BH, yeah it was better. I feel like a jerk for even admitting it and I don't have any consequences by saying so, I can't imagine having to say that to someone's face and I'm glad Ididn'thave to.

But. Was the AP the best I've ever had? no. If I compared it to the beginning of exBH and me, I'd say ex was probably better than AP. But not incredibly notable, you could also say it was "different" as we were in our early 20s with the sex drive of rabbits 😁

Sadly, too, I didn't have a healthy outlook on sex. I can't even say exBH was better for the emotional connection, I lacked the ability for intimacy greatly..so I might be different for that alone and my answer probably doesn't reflect the majority.

I think even if its true for other waywards it's hard to admit something so crushing to your already bleeding out BS. I'm sure it would feel as if one were delivering the final death blow. No one wants to do that. I don't think I've ever seen a WS say it was better. And there are only two reasons why, either it wasn't (believable) or because of fear (also believable). How does one know?

To say it was different isn't a stretch of the imagination as the AP and BS are different people, of course its different, in ways that every partner is different.

it is extremely hard for a WS to tell their BS that

their OM was better in bed.

Specially when the WS is trying

to recover their marriage.

Answer seems pretty obvious as it's included in your question--it must have only been different and not better or the WS would not be trying to recover their M. Trust actions, not words? Then you have your answer. When compared, the BS obviously wins. Anybody denying this obvious truth during R is simply letting their fears take them down the rabbit hole. A WS who is staying and doing the work is proving where they want to be. Accept it.

The not being able to accept the truth that is staring you in the face is a challenge for IC. But the fears and worry can be overcome.

foreverlabeled,

You basically said sex with your AP was better at the time of your affair but sex with your former BH was better at the beginning of your relationship with him. I think this is the best case scenario with my WW. Do you think this is the most common affair scenario since affair sex is usually more intense than married sex ?

You also admitted that you have never seen a WS say it was better with AP. Can you think of any collection of questions a BS could ask their WS to extract the truth from them directly or via a polygraph ?

Another thing that you admitted was that your fBH asked about your AP's penis size. You said you answered honestly. I assume this means your BH had a bigger penis than your AP. Do you think there was any way you ever would have answered this question honestly without being forced to take a polygraph if your AP had a bigger penis ? ( I assume no woman on the planet would ever answer this question honestly if her AP had a bigger penis than her BH without a pending polygraph )

You said:

"I think even if its true for other waywards it's hard to admit something so crushing to your already bleeding out BS. I'm sure it would feel as if one were delivering the final death blow. No one wants to do that. I don't think I've ever seen a WS say it was better. And there are only two reasons why, either it wasn't (believable) or because of fear (also believable). How does one know?"

You are absolutely correct. Unfortunately, it is impossible to polygraph subjective feelings or opinions so I will never know.

[This message edited by Username123 at 10:59 PM, January 18th (Monday)]

In order for us to help people we need to encourage them to address these rather than convince them they do not exist.

I had sex with other partners before marriage. It's not hard for me to understand the explanation of "different". That said, it doesn't make sense to me why people get so hung up on whether their cheating spouse's sexual experience with an AP was "better" or "worse". Either way, the WS has rejected what s/he had at home in favor of what the AP is offering, even if that rejection was a temporary one. "Better", "worse", or "different" won't change what happened. Whether it was for a day, a week, a year, or forever, the abandonment HAPPENED and in that space of time, the AP was preferred. I can't speak for anyone else, but IMHO, THAT's the source of the pain and where the focus should be.

chamomiletea, yes the AP was preferred.

Many a WW cut off sex with their BH during their PA. How

can a WW claim that sex with her BH was just as good or

better then with her OM.

A BH when asking his WW if she liked sex better with,

whose body was more fit, taller, penis bigger, is the BH

looking for any way that he can claim he was better than

than the OM.

A partial victory to ease the pain from being beaten up by

his WW PA. Example the OM was fat, the BH had always

gone to the gym, is toned, looks good with shirt on and off.

It gives him something to build on repairing his ego.

I would not want to know if a wife/GF had a relationship

before me with a man that was taller, better looking, super

fit, better income and better in bed. Her past is her past.

Even if because of shared custody I found out that her ex was

famous actor, pro athlete, millionaire, I would never ask her

about that past relationship to prevent retroactive jealousy.

However if a WW had a PA I could not stop myself from

wanting to know everything. Being told it was different

would sound to me that a WW is just doing damage control.

Come to think of it that even if a WW said her BH was better

in bed it would make the BH suspect that WW is just doing

damage control.

After years from DDays and a lot of discussions I've gleaned the following from WH.

In no particular order I've heard "different" explained as:

* it was exciting from the standpoint that it was forbidden

* it was exciting until it was over and then it was OMG what have I done and why do I keep doing it?

* it was just sex - like masturbation but with someone else

* I kept thinking each time would be the last time

* it became a chore

* it was toxic

I could go on - some of it straight from the handbook - the rest variation on a theme.

I never asked if it was BETTER. Physically - I'm sure there was the possibility of some aspects of that. I tell myself of course it wasn't BETTER - because it wasn't with ME. The one he came home to - even when DDay blew it all up. He kicked her to the freaking curb. So did her BH [although she eventually did the walk of shame].

BETTER - no freaking way.

More physically pleasing - in the eye of the beholder

Does all that hurt - exponentially

Answer seems pretty obvious as it's included in your question--it must have only been different and not better or the WS would not be trying to recover their M. Trust actions, not words? Then you have your answer. When compared, the BS obviously wins. Anybody denying this obvious truth during R is simply letting their fears take them down the rabbit hole. A WS who is staying and doing the work is proving where they want to be. Accept it.

The not being able to accept the truth that is staring you in the face is a challenge for IC. But the fears and worry can be overcome.

Owningitnow, best sex is not why a woman marries a man.

She marries him for looks, hygiene, income, values, etc. Yes

the sex has to be good because those other things will not

make up for bad sex.

Because a WW wants to recover her marriage does not mean

that the sex with her OM was not on porn star level. Toe

curling the best sex she ever had.

For the BH to recover is he has to not just forget that his WW

had a PA, that he enjoyed sex with his WW before and her

body has not changed after her PA, so he has to push was the

sex was better or possibly better with the OM.

A BH cannot make his equipment bigger than the OM after

D day. If shorter no amount of gym time will make him

stronger than the OM. Same if OM makes double the income.

Add to this:

Many times the BH gets a WW that was dumped soon as the

OMW finds out. Or the when caught realizes the sex with

her OM is not worth losing everything else in her life for her

AP. So the WW comes back wanting recovery.

The BH realizes this yet has to eat his panino di merda

to keep from losing his life style, house, family intact.

When BH's ask their WW questions they need to know that

their WW is now willing to be honest. Her being honest with

the details of her PA shows that she is being honest that her

PA is over. That she will not break NC. That is the OM breaks

NC she will tell her BH right away.

I will also admit there is pain shopping being done by the AP

during the questioning. Though the questions asking about

direct comparisons better the OM and the BH is the BH

seeking not just for things were the OM was better than the

BH, but for things the BH was better so he has something

to salvage his pride. Example the OM penis was bigger but

he could not last as long as BH.

You are right that it's a no-win question kind of situation. If we say it was better, that's not going to be received well. If we say it was worse, we will not be believed. If we say it was different, then that seems like a way of saying it was better without saying it was better.

The truth is noone can answer this for another BS. I suspect that it can be anything and everything in between. People do tend to stick with tried and true in long term relationships, if not careful it can become routine at any time. It's part of the reality of a long term relationship, but who's responsible for that? Isn't she as responsible as you to make sure that it's a good experience? Isn't she responsible for speaking up and asking for something different?

In that way, it's just like everything else, you didn't fail her if there was no way for you to know what she wanted.

I also think it doesn't help that women and men in general (and again not always) view sex a bit differently so a BS is really only left with the projection of how they see or experience sex rather than a true picture of the other's perceptions.

Sure, there are women and men who are judgmental about performance. I don't think that's the masses of either gender. For myself, and I can only speak for myself, emotional connection is important for me sexually. Also, I didn't find anyone I slept with to be a big outlier of really bad or really great, not at least at first. There are differences between them but very similar on the scale of sex.

The times I had the best sex of my life is with my husband or other longer term relationships because there was an interest and effort in learning what either liked over time and then having the comfort level to be able to put away inhibitions or worry how my body looks, smells, what he is thinking about it, etc.

As for the affair sex itself, I would say it was exciting in a new relationship way. I would say it lacked in the comfort and knowledge and intimacy area. It was higher in the adrenaline aspect, but that was really the only edge I would say it had. Truthfully, I can generate the adrenaline aspect with my husband by doing things that are a bit more risky (like a public place). But, when you turn it around, you can't manufacture the other stuff (emotional connection, comfort, knowledge) that I got from my husband with someone I didn't know well.

That's the best way I can explain "what does different mean". But, I have had sex with my husband for decades. I had sex with the AP 3 times. So, out of sheer volume alone, who do you think I have had the best mind blowing sex with?

And, if I wasn't wouldn't it be my responsibility to go to my husband and teach/show him what I wanted? My pleasure is my responsibility, and I feel like in many ways this post makes it the mans. And, I will just say I am going to guess the majority of the time that the person more interested in making the woman's toe curl is the husband. And, effort and interest and knowledge of what the other likes is generally what makes a good lover. Difficult to compare fast food and a steak? They are different.

I think this really is just like everything else when you look at affairs in general. If the woman (or man) is having an affair because they are unsatisfied sexually. Who is responsible for the state of that? The person not speaking up.

[This message edited by hikingout at 8:44 AM, January 19th (Tuesday)]

Owningitnow, best sex is not why a woman marries a man.

She marries him for looks, hygiene, income, values, etc. Yes

the sex has to be good because those other things will not

make up for bad sex.

This doesn't ring true to me. Maybe it's a generational thing. Gen X and below? Women factor sex in quite a bit as far as I can tell of myself and friends.

I didn't marry my husband for his looks or income. I can support myself, as can most women these days. If hygiene was a concern I agree, that would be a problem. I don't know many people with hygiene issues.

I married my husband for lots of reasons, but here are my top:

1. He IS my best sexual partner. I did care about that a lot. I divorced my first husband primarily because we were sexually incompatible.

2. We share sensibilities and tend to agree about direction, things we enjoy, how kids should be raised, how money should be spent, etc.

3. Because he is intelligent, funny, and I enjoy being with him.

That's it. I tend to think men and women may look for different things in partners, but the vein is very similiar. It is big picture but sex is just important to a lot of us as it is to you. And, while some people will marry a wallet, I do not think that's the norm. I see men doing that about as much as women these days.

[This message edited by hikingout at 8:53 AM, January 19th (Tuesday)]

I would echo CT and HO. I had a period where I had a lot of sex. I was juggling women without their knowing. There was a thrill to it. There were days where I had sex with more than one woman in the same day. In short order I went from big boobs to small, from wide shoulders to slender, from flat ass to round. Tall to short. Etc. I can vividly recall wondering what all the hoopla was about. The sex was in fact different, but not better, at least not because of the identity of the partner. Sometimes, the circumstances made sex more thrilling, but it was the circumstances, not the partner.

That said, another related theme that comes up is a cheating spouse exerting more sexual energy and showing more sexual brio to the AP than in the marriage. To me, in that case, it wouldn't be about whether the A sex was better, it would be that the WS tried harder for the AP than he/she tried for me. People tend to try harder when they want the thing more. That for me would be very difficult, likely impossible, to overcome.

I also agree 100% with HO that, objectively, the best sex I've had was with a long-term partner where we spent time learning what each other likes. It's like being in a band. The best music is with long-term band mates that you've spent years learning to play with.

[This message edited by Butforthegrace at 10:14 AM, January 19th (Tuesday)]

I’ve always hated when my mind goes down this rabbit hole. The fact of the matter is, I will never know exactly how they fucked, or what was going through his mind before, during, and after it. He’s a man, so of course he orgasmed. He was wearing a condom every time, as a woman I don’t know if that actually makes a difference in sensation or not. I do know orgasms never feel bad lol. I can speculate on so many things, but then I can also look at the facts. He could have had sex with her more than he did when they were having sex, and he could have kept having sex with her way longer than he did, but he didn’t. When he tells me the guilt of it was too much to fully enjoy, I can believe that, because his actions of stopping the physical part of their relationship reflect as much.

I’ve been with my WH for 14 years. It took about 11 of those before we really started communicating about what we want in the bedroom. Since then, we’ve spent years working together to make our sex life more satisfying for the both of us. That effort, plus feeling completely comfortable with each other, zero guilt, and a true intimacy, I don’t believe for one second their gross hookups could have possibly been better.

Different coming from the WS means one of 2 things:

1 - Better

Or

2 - even if it wasn't better, they still wanted it more.