SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Double post

[This message edited by easterlily at 6:13 PM, December 10th (Saturday)]

Hello 123. Good to see you. I think this is a better forum for you just now and I am glad you landed here.

Homealone,

Since it now appears you are all about honesty. Let me give you some Betrayed spouse honesty.

My formerly wayward wife and I are 3 years past Dday. She had a 6 month EA/PA. She rewarded the AP with sex for meeting her emotional needs. I know the AP and I happen to know that the AP is in no way an equal to me in a physical sense.

My wife and I have reconciled.

I have to tell you that had my wayward wife told me that she never O ed with me but did with the AP my response would have been to go live with the AP we are done !

My wife and I have raised two successful adult children and if she had so little respect for me and our children to pursue an O outside our marriage and then told me ?

I am not telling you to lie to your husband. I am telling you that the just sex is a deal breaker for many of us.

You could substitute what you did with the gym instructor with what my wife did with the contractor working on our houee It sounds like you think the fact that it was a purely sexual relationship and no emotions will some how Make this easier to swallow than if you were emotionally tied to him. Trust me, in my case it made it worse. My wife threw away a decades old marriage simply to have NSA sex with a guy who treated her like basically like a common whore We were also in a good place at the time with her professing her love to me. I think I might have actually felt better if she tossed me aside for at least someone she cared about.

Also to men, being just replaced for better sex can be debilitating. I too would caution you about telling him how you could orgasm with him and not your husband. I forced my wife to give me the details and it probably was a mistake. You have to answer his questions but I hope you are gentle.

You husband did what I should have done and for five years it tore me up inside until I basically did the same thing. I never could look at her again other than the OM plaything. We are now separated. It was such a waste of what could have been.

Hopefully you guys can make it through.

He deserves to know who and what he is dealing with now. Because the old you, the one he married, died the day you slept with the OM.

You screwed another guy for about 2 years. Because you were curious.

Well it's not about you anymore. It's about your husband.

Respect his wishes. If he wants details give them. If he does not then keep quiet.

And realize that if he does give you a 2nd chance you do not get to be "curious" again. So if you feel the need to be "curious" again, if you are just white knuckling it to keep your knees together, then be honest about that with him and let him go.

[This message edited by ramius at 2:40 AM, December 11th (Sunday)]

BS here, I'll try to keep this one brief...

I know someone already pulled you up on your "My life is destroyed", saying it should really be "I destroyed my life", but add on top that "I have destroyed my entire family's life".

Whatever pain you're going through right now at the prospect of your future being forever altered, consider your husband's pain at the same thing, only he had no control over it happening, and the woman he thought loved him turned out to be a completely different person. The woman he loved never existed, and he now has to not only mourn his relationship, but mourn the woman who died on DDay. That is what he is going through right now, whilst you're trying to scramble getting things back to normal.

I won't twist the knife on that any harder, I know you said you've had it in the neck from another board. And I do know the WS suffers immensely too, I've broken up with my WS but I have so much sympathy for her for doing this to herself.

I know I'm rambling a bit but the main piece of advice I'm think trying to convey is that you seem intent on "winning your husband back", but you need to be prepared for the face that his mind may already be made up. Read TurnOtherCheek's thread "Punch to the gut..." on the Just Found Out forum, her husband has been trying to win her back and seems remorseful but her mind is solidly on divorcing. The best you can do is work on yourself first and foremost, and be there to help your husband heal if he lets you, but the idea of a happy M is a long way off if it's even possible at all.

That said, however bleak it looks at the moment, you have such a long history with this man, and you have children, even if you don't remain married you will have an ongoing relationship with him, and you can do your best to be a loving and supportive friend in whatever capacity you can going forward. There will be good times with him ahead, they might just not be exactly what you're hoping for right now.

at that point he told me that he doesn’t want to go to MC or IC or do anything to try to work out of marriage.

Why should he? You had an affair and it was about you. Not the marriage. Not what he didn't give you. Even though you blamed him for your bad choices. You had a voice. You are an adult. If you were unhappy and unfulfilled in the roll you played in your life, that is on you. Not your husband. You should have chosen to change that in a healthy way. Did you ever speak up and tell him how unhappy you were with yourself? Or did you just project that on him and blame (resent) him for it? He wasn't the cause of your immaturity. You were. The sooner you see that, the sooner you can fix yourself. You needed IC. Not your husband. He sounds like a mature adult. Glad to hear you went to IC anyhow.

I have risked all what I care for something that meant nothing to me.

This is bullshit. The man didn't mean anything to you, but something did. Yourself? The high of sex? The attention? The desire from your other man? There was a reason you had an affair and that meant more to you than your marriage, your husband, and your children. So stop saying that and find out what and why. Your husband sees it and knows it. Get it right. Don't bother to cover it up. Just admit what you got from it and what did mean something to you to inflict this Hell on them.

Affair was only for sex, there has been no emotions involved.

This is bullshit too. There may not have been attachment, but there were emotions involved. Or you wouldn't keep going back. You got a high from something. So, there- for =emotions. A high from being wanted? A high from something else? Keep digging. Stop equating emotions to only attachment.

No emotional depth, just the danger, excitement and ego boosts.

What you get from the things mentioned in another post are still emotions for you. Some type of emotional need is still getting filled.

It has been a very difficult day for me today, I have read about the roller-coaster feelings of the BS, about their pain, their anger and fear but I wasn't prepared for the coldness of my husband. He hasn't scream at me or cry or anything else. I could see that he has been crying but when he talked to me he was completely calm and that is scaring me much more that if he would have screamed and called me names like he did the first day.He has told me that at the moment he doesn't know if he wants to divorce me or not, he is thinking about it and will let me know at its due time. He said that just looking at me is very painful because I seem to be the old me, his wife... but she is dead and she has a complete stranger in the body of her wife...

He came with something similar to a contract (cohabitant contract he called and it is for while he decides if he divorces me or not). In that contract there was a list of demands for both him and myself, is a bit of a division of the responsibilities of the house, he doesn't want me to stay at home the whole week anymore, he says our children (16 and 13) are old enough and from now on he wants me to work in the family business 3 days a week and he will work the other 3 days, he will also do his share of home chores.

He doesn't want to sleep in the same bed that I do and he at the moment doesn't want any details about my affair. If he decides reconciling he will then walk that path but if he decides to divorce me then he wants no details at all.

He doesn't want me to call him sweet names (like darling, sweetheart,etc or that I tell him that I love him, he said that if I do love him he will see it in the way I act from now on).

I asked him if he would like to have the list of the places where I would go and if he would like to put a GPS in my phone, he said that he would think about it but that he can't be in a marriage where he need to police me around, if he feels that I am still cheating he will divorce me. I told him that to avoid any confusion I would prefer if he would have full knowledge of where I am the whole day and he agreed. Then he went out of the house and he hasn't come back yet.

I have expended the day with my sons and it has been difficult, they have both been angry and sad at the same time and I have had to reassure them quite often that I love them and while I have made a terrible act against their father, I love them three and I will fight for the family.

In general that was the update so far, now to answer some of the questions here.

I don't know how to quote in this board but I will do my best to answer the related questions.

Owl, I am very happy you are also here, although we didn't agree in all, your advises were wise and helpful!

wk55hn, I am sorry, I guess language can be a barrier sometimes. When I say that I didn't have any feeling for the OM I meant to say that I didn't love him.

Everything that we do generate feelings... I felt horny, excited, validated, naughty with the OM and after I felt guilt, emptiness, confusion, anger and sadness.

As you can see the feelings also depend of the moment...

Sam59 I understand that sex is a deal breaker for some men. I hope my husband is not one of them... although probably it is.

I didn't go into the affair looking to O, my husband is a generous lover and he always made sure I was taken care before he ended. I said that I didn't O by penetration and there are many women that can't O that way. I always thought I was one of those women and I was in shock when OM made me O just by penetration.

I was looking more for excitement and validation I think.

My feeling, he is after revenge.. I'm speaking from BS perspective.

He worked hard for 16 years [your oldest son age], long hours to provide for his family, so you could stay home and when sons got older, take care of yourself which included going to gym where you enjoyed sex with OM.

I understand he was quite young as well when you had children, so he missed a lot of fun, including sex with other women.

So now he wants you to work as much as him at least and not to have an easy ride, living off his hard work and screw him at the same time. He is to teach you how to earn money and appreciate it, be prepared that he will start exploring opportunities with other women. You are not special for him anymore, quite the opposite, lost his respect as woman and a mother.

Your sons will feel very personally your betrayal and it seems will have issues with trust with their future partners. It is a very bad age for them to deal with one parent cheating on another when they just started themselves to be attracted to girls.

I feel sorry for you, but the way you described your husband and his reacting, it seems a matter of time before he moves on without you as his wife, and sadly for you, boys will understand him.

Your husband is handling himself very well given the circumstances. I think that you working in the business is a good plan because you obviously had too much time to yourself to carry on the affair. You should start working harder and reducing your husbands work load, especially since you have added a huge amount of problems onto him with your affair. Given the age that you got together with your husband he gave up his carefree you just like you did. And he didn't cheat. He also worked tremendously hard to make a life for you and your boys and you took a giant shit on all of his hard work.

Some people may disagree but I think your best chance of reconciliation is a separation where your husband can play the field (sleep around) while you take care of home and the business and have some clarity to see if he would actually ever want someone who behaved so horribly back. You got to have a fine secret life on the side while your husband handled the day to day of providing for you and your boys now he should get a chance at the same.

Free 2016 and FearlessGuster, I know that I have done this to myself but now I am left with no other thing that my willingness to fight for my husband and my family and to give them if they accept me what I have deprived them for the last 22 months (a honest, humble and loving wife and mother). I understand that many will find this to come to late and that you and many other may wish my husband will divorce me or take revenge on me. Maybe he will, only time will tell.

I hope that if he ever does something he will just divorce me because if he take revenge and go into an affair he will compromise his integrity and that will make him a broken man, as much broken as I am.

I am not speaking from the pain or the fear that he will cheat, I wish it would be as easy as he just going and get some sex with another woman and comeback to me and our marriage could continue like before I started my affair... but that won't happen anymore... if he cheats will do much more to him than to me. If it happens I would consider myself as guilty for his affair as I am for mine because I know my husband the one before this horror would never even think about it.

Home alone

That is why a separation may be good for him. It gives him the freedom to date other woman without compromising his integrity.

I hope that if he ever does something he will just divorce me because if he take revenge and go into an affair he will compromise his integrity and that will make him a broken man, as much broken as I am.

I am not speaking from the pain or the fear that he will cheat, I wish it would be as easy as he just going and get some sex with another woman and comeback to me and our marriage could continue like before I started my affair... but that won't happen anymore... if he cheats will do much more to him than to me.

You are correct with this thinking. When someone cheats, they not only betray their family, they betray themselves. They compromise all the good traits that they stood for. And I would hope that your husband, no matter how much he is hurting, never decides to have an affair. All that will do is make the marriage that much more difficult to repair. And the truth is, no matter how badly you hurt your husband and children, you do NOT deserve to be cheated on by your husband.

Nothing justifies cheating.

waitedwaytoolong Is there anything that your wife could have done differently from DDay that would have changed the final outcome (Divorce).

Did you feel she did everything to help you heal?

I think your input could really be very important here. If you can think in things that she didn't do that could have help you heal, let me know please!

Separated = still married.

Probably nothing she could have done, but lots we could have done. I know some don't believe me here, but she was remorseful from the second she was busted. On the floor a snot nosed mess, wliling to be accountable to me 24/7.

Mistake number 1 which your husband did and I didn't , was to make her leavethe house to hit home what she did. I did leave for a few days and went dark which she described as torture as I didn't return text or calls, but it's not the same

Mistake number 2 which your husband was also smarter than me was to expose. At least some. She really didn't want it out, but probably would have done it if I insisted. I was the one who made the decision not to as I was so humiliated. So for five years I stewed while all of our friends gushed how great our marriage was. Again, the popular opinion, and I am trying to tread lightly here in this section, is for the WS, the the consequence of seeing me in pain is a consequence for them. Without exposure and real consequences like having your friends and family know, just having to deal with my pain is getting a five year probation for murder. I'm sure there is some pain, but nothing like what the BS feels.

The way she conducted the affair in our house might still have made it impossible to reconcile, but having her life virtually unchanged for five years while I got destroyed probably was the death blow.

It is all out now, and I was stupid. For me it wasn't as bad as I thought, and I think in time it will still suck for her, especially if we ultimately divorce, but is still better than me resenting her like I did.

The way your husband has handled this gets around these two big mistakes.

Lots of other mistakes like both of us not going to IC, bailing on MC after having a terrible one the first time, not selling my house where this all took place. I am a textbook of what not to do

I just want to reiterate, don't think that because it was just sex it will make it easier to accept.

I know that I have done this to myself but now I am left with no other thing that my willingness to fight for my husband and my family and to give them if they accept me what I have deprived them for the last 22 months (a honest, humble and loving wife and mother).

Not trying to point that it is your fault... but from personal experience of feeling betrayed, the way your husband is handling the situation, shows that it is a deal breaker for him.

He exposed your A to sons immediately, because he knows that they are old enough and to D. their mother out of the blue would be impossible without a weighty reason.

He also seems a man who won't be cheating behind your back, but rather move on to someone else, therefore exposure to family. No one would blame him now, he did his best, you sucked.

He might have weak moments, but do not be fooled. Your boys are old enough.. It would be harder for him, if kids were little but not in your case.

All in his hands, be prepared to let him go.

I did not handle first days after DDay as good as your husband, but almost 7 months out, I often think about D as the only solution that could bring me peace of mind at some point of time. My WH tries to fix his issues very hard, and yet nothing gives me satisfaction.

What can you do that potentially could give you a chance to R?

Do as he said regarding business without complaints and expectations of praise. Take care of boys - usual chores, be there for them but also they might need space, distance from you, so react calmly and with understanding.

You would have to be ready to live like that for long period of time. Any attempts to move on and enjoy yourself with anything or anyone apart from your family, would trigger him. He must heal before you, so be humble as much as you can

As a BH,

I am a man here but want to ask,

Did you set it in your mind that your husband couldn't get you to O from PIV sex? Sort of doomed before he started.

Since your AP had nothing but fantasy land and sex to discuss and you always saw the best in him and his words (unicorn rainbow farts) did he have an unfair advantage in your mind during sex?

I think if you truly explore what was happening and separate out the lies and see your sex with AP for what it was and not what you made it in your mind that you will see your husband has always been honest and attracted to you through kids, aging, sicknesses, and just real life. What you had with AP was all your own projections. He was not a good guy, he did not value you, he did not care who you were (a mother a wife), he did nothe care at all only that he got his notch in the bed post. And you let go and gave him that but in doing so robbed it from your husband. You could have directed that fantasy or energy into your marriage and husband. Instead you stole it to give to the traveling salesman at the door.

If your husband asks tell him everything. Even the sex related stuff but be sure to break it down or at least start seeing it for what it truly was. The AP could have been anyone, in fact it could have been a suction cup dildo in the shower. It was the mental energy and robbing of the attention that should have been spent inside your marriage that gave you that PIV O...

Your husband will not see 22m as just sex. Every text, every picture you sent, every oh ah minute will be seen as a relationship and he will see that theft of energy and attention away from the family and him.

I probably went off topic and blabbering but hope I at least made you think and raise your own questions.

Aso for what you can do. You can't do anything. He is in control of his life. You are of yours. Become vulnerable to him. Know it is out of your hands. Work on you, be authentic in your healing and growth. He is looking and everyday even through divorce proceedings is a chance to show him you are changing.

[This message edited by sneaker at 6:36 PM, December 11th (Sunday)]

Apparently, your husband had long been relegated as a scapegoat for your perceived "loss" of your youth and opportunities to have sex with as many men as you would deem necessary to conclude your youth as having been "fun".

If I had long simmering resentments toward my XWW while we were married - I doubt I could have O'd with her while having any type of sex - what a turn-off!

Your husband never stood a chance with you as far as that goes.

I'm sure he could have taken the opportunities to have sex with other women, behind your and your children's backs, that he found more attractive and found it far more thrilling and satisfying than with you.

But he didn't.

Because he knows that none of that would have been worth it, nor an excuse to deeply betray you and your children's trust, and destroy his children's foundation.

Because he valued all that.

But you didn't.

It didn't have anything to do with the sex, the penetrative O's, or his "stamina".

I'm sure he would have welcomed honest communication about all that and enjoyed working on improving the sex life for both himself and you.

You did it because you and him are vastly different people who have learned to value vastly different things.

By demonstration, he shows he values loyalty, family, hard work, his wife, and his word.

By your demonstration, you show you value................???

And, you didn't think you would get caught.

I hope your husband and children come out ok.

waitedwaytoolong Thank you for your input. I will try to bring my BH to MC but at this moment he doesn't want to hear about it. I have suggested him that if he doesn't want MC at least he should go to IC, I don't know if he will.

Free2016 It is out of my control if he will stay or leave. I can only work on myself and let him see that I am trying to heal and that I am in for the reconciliation fight if he wants to try it.

I know that my actions will have consequences, either divorce or the hard road of the reconciliation.

sneaker The fact is that I had sex with my husband at the age of 17, he was my first and only one till I started the affair... O by PIV just didn't happened for me and I assumed that I was one of those woman that can't O by PIV. (Statistics says that 80% of women can't Orgasm from PIV). But my husband always made sure I was satisfied in other ways before he ended so it was never important for me.

Now I know that I can, and I also know that I could do it with my husband as well. It was all inexperience, unfortunately I don't think my husband will be very happy to hear that I can teach him how to make me O by PIV the way I learned it from OM (that if my husband ever wants to have sex with me). This is all so complicated...

keptmyword The problem is that I didn't know that I was missing something and that I needed to have an open conversation with him about improving our sex life. I didn't go into the affair because I felt dissatisfied with my sex life. While the affair was just sex, the validation and the thrill was much more important than the sex at the beginning... when I found out the reactions OM could get from my body it became much more about the sex and much less about the validation and the ego boost.

Probably it doesn't makes sense... never the less it was exactly like that.

[This message edited by homealone123 at 6:00 AM, December 12th (Monday)]