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The texts are on my iMac that she can't access so she won't be able to delete them. I will also need them as evidence and I plan on reading them. The only person I have told this to is my oldest sister who was friends with my wife in high school. She cannot believe how my wife is doing this to me and what is going through her head. I didn't know who else to tell and she's been very supportive.

It's not easy to tell others, I feel humiliated knowing that my wife is having an affair with this asshole. I'm on the fence about her quitting her job. I know it seems like the most rational thing to stop contact with the other guy but if I decide to divorce I don't want have to pay her alimony for destroying our marriage. God how I wish adultery voided paying alimony and spousal support.

[This message edited by manualgtr at 2:58 PM, January 10th (Tuesday)]

What you need to understand as quickly as possible is:

1. Your wife isn't the person you've believed her to be all of these years. She has a character gap that has been hidden away and it has led her to try to fill/numb it by cheating.

2. While she is having the affair, she is in a "fog". Another way of putting it is that she is, in a way, "addicted" to the ego kibbles she is getting. As a result, she is self-centered, solely focused on maintaining her "high" and unconcerned about anyone or anything else.

3. Cheaters lie, manipulate, blameshift, minimize and control all to cater to their own self-centered interests.

4. Once caught, a wayward will often fencesit in an attempt to have two people competing for their affection. For the wayward, it is the best of both worlds.

With that all in mind, let me translate a few things for you...

Saying I've been ignoring her needs and working too much and not giving her enough affection and attention.

This is rewriting history and blameshifting. She is trying to justify her horrific actions to herself by trying to convince herself (and you) that this is all your fault.

doesn't know what she wants...she's just so confused

She knows exactly what she wants. She wants the ability to continue to pursue the affair, get the ego kibbles she is addicted to and have you do the "Pick Me!" dance while she sits on the fence. She wants to fencesit for right now with the intention of either continuing to enjoy the attention from both you and the other man or she wants more time to see if she wants to leave you for this other guy.

She just keeps saying she doesn't want to get divorced because she still "loves me"

This is just more manipulation. She wants to fencesit and she wants you to stick around and do the "Pick Me!" dance.

I suggested counseling but she is skeptical and doesn't know if it will help.

See a trend here? More fencesitting.

She won't leave the house and said maybe I should stay with my parents for a few days.

This is pure manipulation and control along with a heavy does of self-centeredness. She has broken her marriage vows, won't end the affair and thinks you should be the one to move out.

She has also been more angry and easier to flip out on stupid shit, she was never like this before.

This is just a different tactical approach to manipulation/control when you won't fall for her other tactics.

She said it will just hurt me more than I already have been.

No. She doesn't care. Continuing the affair is hurting you more than you already have been. Not having you look at the evidence is manipulating you so that she can continue to -- you guessed it -- fencesit.

she said ghosting him is a shitty thing to do.

This is a particularly twisted way to manipulate you. She is telling you that she believes that it is important to treat others with respect, so that she won't agree to ghost anyone. On its own, that is a fair statement. The problem is that she is (1) treating you with immense disrespect by having an affair with this guy, (2) she is prioritizing him over you and (2) she is manipulating and disrespecting you by even trying to use this logic.

What the fuck do I do?

She is treating you with a lack of love and disrespect. You should NEVER accept that, but you currently are. That is where she gets her power. The more she is able to manipulate you into accepting the disrespect, the more blatant she is able to be about flaunting what she is doing in front of you.

Stop accepting the unacceptable. Let natural consequences play out.

1. Stop being her secret keeper.

- Check again to see if the man has a wife. I'm assuming that you only know that he is divorced because your wife told you that. If he has a wife, tell her.

- Do her family/friends know? At least the ones who could be helpful and influential with her should know.

2. See an attorney and educate yourself on your rights ASAP. While you need to stop accepting disrespect, there are legal bounds around what you can/can't do. Throw her out of the house? If she is part owner, you can't force her (but you could request/insist and she might go).

3. Stop giving her time to "sort herself out". She doesn't need time. She isn't confused. You won't tolerate having another man in your marriage. She either fully respects that boundary right now or she is showing you she still thinks she can manipulate/control you. If she won't stop, serve her with divorce papers.

4. Stop letting her have her way. Why do you have to move out of your bedroom? She can take the guest room.

5. Detach, detach, detach. She is pressing your buttons and doing everything she can in order to manipulate you. If she won't end the affair, there is NOTHING to talk about. You need to gain some time/space to get some clarity on what she is doing to you and to decide what your next steps are. Check out the FAQ for Betrayed Spouses, especially the 180, to help you here (http://www.survivinginfidelity.com/faq_bs.asp).

6. Find support for yourself. You've come here, which is a great place to vent, ask for advice and be encouraged. Find an IC (individual counselor) who is knowledgeable in trauma and infidelity to help you deal with the massive emotional trauma you've been hit with. Also look carefully through your family and friends to identify the few that are highly empathetic, care deeply about you/your marriage and are able to stand by you when you need to grieve and be consoled.

7. You are being "too nice" right now. It doesn't sound possible, but it is. In fact, it can be an engrained pattern for some. If that sounds like it might be you, "No More Mr. Nice Guy" could be very enlightening.

Great Advice so far.

Strong recommendations from me are this and in this order.

1. NO MORE UNPROTECTED SEX. The last thing you need is her turning up pregnant, and the 9 months of hell to follow feeling you need to stay, but may not be yours. Not fair to you and certainly not fair to an unborn child to come into a a world w/ dysfunctional parents from the word go.

2. See a lawyer - find out your legal rights responsiblities, and what a D would look like, and are there other options, S, or post nup.

3. Get STD tested.

4. If this CoW has a spouse figure out who it is and tell them NOW.

I felt the same way you did, like I was a big failure. As time when on, and I didn't have this site and the AWESOME people to help me, I realized that this was something she did. She was broken and would have done this to me with whatever guy had been willing at the time. Hold you head high, be proud to be you, be strong and hold her 100% accountable for this shit.

Read the messages now, put a VAR in her car and get the truth. Once you have the truth and know what you want to do, the folks on here can give you ideas of what works best for R or D.

Get mad, get strong and take charge of this!!!

Every time someone has posted "no sex swearing on life of (parent, child, etc.), it turns out there was sex. Every time. That is what I have seen through many threads. It seems to be part of the cheaters script, a list of behaviors that just about all cheaters do.

If you were to read a lot of threads here, you would see the same behaviors your wife is doing. You would see a lot of betrayed spouse who basically try to convince logically their cheater to stop. It NEVER works. Eventually, when the betrayed is ready to leave the marriage, then the cheater usually agrees to end the affair, and commit to fixing the marriage. I could post a half dozen recent ones like that, and since Soulhurt posted here, take a look at his.

The affair you are describing is a cliche here. She is infatuated with her coworker, got the butterflies, and it feels good, and somehow she doesn't realize that a long-term marriage no longer gets that.

It's easy for him to give her plenty of attention, he works with her all day. Then when they talk/message, they talk only of love and sex. When she talks to you, it's about the issues with the kids, the fridge isn't working, we need to save more money for our vacation, your mom needs help because she is in the hospital - oh, and can we fit in a few minutes to smooch a bit?

You can try explaining that to your wife, but it won't work. What will work is if you refuse to tolerate it.

Mist seems they are too afraid they'll lose their marriage. If your wife is telling other man she loves him and is having sex with him (read the texts), then what marriage do you have?

What are you afraid of? Losing her? Or sharing her? Maybe Bigger will post, he explains it well.

I'm on the fence about her quitting her job. I know it seems like the most rational thing to stop contact with the other guy but if I decide to divorce I don't want have to pay her alimony for destroying our marriage.

You're exactly right. If she agrees to end the affair, quitting her job is a part of establishing no contact. If she won't end the affair and you need to file for divorce, losing/quitting her job would impact you financially.

I wish adultery voided paying alimony and spousal support.

Welcome to the club. Some states still allow for "at fault" divorce and that will have an impact on alimony/support. However, the level of proof that needs to be established varies, there are legal costs involved in doing so and there are defenses you'd need to be aware of.

In addition, some states have "alienation of affection" laws. Same type of deal -- does the settlement come close to offsetting the time and expense involved.

This is where educating yourself with a good attorney comes into play. A good one should (1) give you the objective news on what works/doesn't, (2) not just push for what is going to pay out the most legal fees and (3) be willing, but realistic in terms of how hard they think you can push for favorable terms.

If I had a nickel for every time I have read that a WS has sworn on someone important life they did not sleep with the OP and then later found to have done so, I would be independently wealthy.

Or a lot of innocent would be dropping dead out of the blue.

I'm doing some more digging about the other guy. I'm going to find out for sure if he is divorced or if my wife was lying, with her word I don't know what to believe. I feel like I'm going to have someone with me to read the texts between them, I just don't think I could stomach it.

I know what he looks like and personally think he's a downgrade physically. I just can't help but feeling insecure. My wife and I were supposed to go to Vegas and stay at the MGM grand before I found out about the affair but I have canceled it and got my money back thankfully. She was furious.

Toss your ring in the trash, lawyer up, and minimize contact with her. If she drops to her knees and capitulates to all your requirements for R when she sees you pursuing D, then you can consider it.

But honestly, no kids and income parity...you should dump this one for a woman with better character before the stakes get higher.

Co worker means they see each other in person often. A lot of opportunity to get physical despite her swearing on mom's life. She's "in-love" and flat out refused to stop communicating w/ him...saying it would be "shitty thing to do" Her indiscretion confuses me as she could have easily placated you since she sees him at work. I doubt it just "emotional"...but I am rooting for you. Read the texts and hide a recorder in her car. Her flipping at the notion of you reading the texts is another red flag.

She won't leave the house and said maybe I should stay with my parents for a few days

Another red flag. She professes love for another...and suggests you leave the house.

There is a bright side here...although I don't expect you to see it yet.

-You are young

-No kids

-Equal incomes

it sounds like you can/should have a pretty clean divorce should it come to that. Please read what I pasted below as it may help you act swiftly & decisively:

Newbies - if you love them, and they are not remorseful, have a think about starting a divorce. OK, so this one is going to take a little explaining, because it's very counter intuitive and divorce would surely be the last things on our minds.

Here's your checklist

You

1. Feel your life has imploded

2. Are devastated

3. Cannot understand how to survive the next day

4. Desperately want to save the marriage

5. Believe you love your spouse

6. Have something in your gut telling you your spouse should be doing more

7. Feel like you would "know" if they were completely remorseful and just don't feel it.

Them

1. Are defensive

2. Do what you ask, but only because you get so upset.

3. Don't go above and beyond, don't amaze you with how much they do to help you

4. Get angry or defensive

5. Use any of the following

. I'm confused

. I don't know if I love you

. I need to find myself

. You're being too demanding

. I probably had the affair because you....

If they above rings true, divorce should at least be on your agenda of options.

Right then I suppose I'd better justify this.

Look, why would you stay married to such a person? not only did they devastate you, but they are continuing to hurt you. There's no reason to be married to a person like that! You want to be married to someone that protects you, treasures you, loves you, and makes you feel loved. The person you thought existed didn't. that person is selfish, cruel, heartless. They are a liar, an adulter. Who wants to be married to a loser like that? What they have done is perfectly reasonable grounds for divorce. so do it. Divorce them immediately.

You have to accept the reality of your wayward spouse's situation. They are confused about whom they love, whom they want to be with. The worst case scenario is that they will continue the affair, and because the affair is addictive, and makes them feel good, they will do this in all situations possible, no matter what the effect on you is. You are probably thinking that your situation is different. It really isn't. If the worst case scenario doesn't happen then your spouse is going to exist in a sort of limbo, not knowing where to turn. All this time your soul will be dying because you will not be able to comprehend that the person you love didn't come running back into your arms once you caught them or the affair was exposed. It does happen, but it's very, very rare. Much more likely is that you will both exist in a limbo, not knowing what will happen next, or how to move forward. The WS will be confused, and the BS will be utterly devastated. This shit needs to end, and it will ONLY end when the BS says it ends. If your WS says they need time, or distance, or space. If they say they are confused, they are lost, they "regret" the affair, or "reg that you got hurt" then they DO NOT GET WHAT THEY HAVE DONE TO YOU and will NOT get it until you put your foot down and say enough. It's terrible enough to be the victim of infidelity, but the sad reality is that somehow you have to dredge up the strength to fight for you spouse if you want them back, despite what they have done to you. Fighting means tough love. It means putting an end to their nonsense. It means waking them up to what they are about to realise. Or even letting them go if they do not wake up. It means instigating divorce proceedings.

Beginning divorce proceedings has a number of benefits for you

1. Self Respect.

Infidelity trashes your self respect. Claim some back by taking control of the situation. Now the relationship is taking a path YOU have defined, that YOU are in control of. As a new BS you will crave control, crave rationality. Beginning a divorce will give you this control.

2. A bullshit time limit

An unremorseful wayward spouse is a nasty piece of work. They will lie, manipulate, and continue to betray you. They will protect themselves and their lover at your expense, and the expense of any children. They will tell you everything you need to hear, but only when you drag it out of them in agony. They will be difficult, argumentative, angry and defensive. Basically, they are unpleasant people. Critically, they will CONTINUE to be unpleasant people until YOU do something about it. They will sit on the fence, wrapped up in their own feelings, whilst your soul dies. You may think that YOUR spouse is different. They arn't. beginning divorce proceedings puts a finite time limit on their bullshit. They can lie to you, make you feel like YOU are the bad guy, give you every excuse in the book as to why they are not stepping up and fixing the marriage, but the clock is ticking.When they clock expires, you are free of all teir bullshit and can start the healing process.

3. Vision

A BS's world is very dark. We wonder how to survive today, never mind tomorrow. There appears to be no future. We can see no life without misery. We can see no freedom, no light, no smiling, no joy. All ahead is dark. Start divorce proceedings. Now you have a future. It may not be the future you had ever hoped for, but it's a future. Sometime to aim for, something to plan for. Something that will force you to get some sleep so you can organise your life.

4. Healing

If you are with an uremorseful wayward spouse, things are going to get worse, not better. You are certainly not going to start healing. that happens when they become remorseful, or you are free of them.

so divorce the bastards. They are not worth being married to.

However.

Maybe. Just maybe. Maybe that pathetic excuse for a spouse isn't the limit of their potential. Maybe they have it within them to actually be the person you thought they were. Hell. Maybe they can be MORE than you or they ever thought. The wayward spouses on here who are remorseful are incredibly self aware, rounded human beings. They stand no nonsense. They examine themselves for their faults relentlessly. They make you want to stand up and applaud. They make you want to be a better man. Wouldn't it be nice if you were married to a person like that. THAT would be fucking awesome. Well, remember why you fell in love. you believe that person is worth more, or you wouldn't still be reading this post. Filing for divorce MIGHT just make them

1. Realise what they are about to lose

2. Take a long hard look at themselves

3. Recognise that their bullshit, lying, and manipulating is pointless, because the clock just keeps ticking.

there are countless tales on here, including my own, where nothing happened until the BS retook control of the relationship. The WS sat on the fence happily destroying the BS, wrapped up in their own little drama, UNTIL the BS decided they had had enough and took control.

So, you start divorce proceedings. what are the possible outcomes.

1. They sort themselves out and start to "get it"

Keep the proceedings going until you are damn sure you have someone who is remorseful, not someone who is just playing up to get you to stop. You can always restart the process. In the UK its awesome because there are several points where you can basically press the "pause" button, and then start it rolling again. However, if they really do realise what they have lost and start to fight for it, then you can kill the process. That's what happened for me, and I'm convinced it's what a lot of people need to be doing.

2. They get angry and leave

Wave them goodbye with a smile. Good riddance - all you have done is start a process you would have to have gone down in the end anyway, so all that's happened is that you have shortcutted the process, saved yourself from tolerating their craziness, and retaken control of your life. Hell, they may even come crawling back. It happens. what happens after that is of course, up to you.

3. They continue lying and cheating

Well, sounds like a good reason to divorce someone to me.

Look, I am VERY pro marriage. I believe that with a remorseful wayward spouse, and a forgiving Betrayed Spouse, marriages can be stronger and more fulfilling than they ever were before the affair, because neither partner is now taking the other for granted. Both are working at the marriage. I would rather get to that point without the agony of betrayal, but hey. However, I am NOT pro foggy remorseful spouse. It breaks my heart to read post after post from betrayed spouses who have just been stabbed in the heart and still have the courage to want to save their marriage, whilst their WS is still in foggy lala land. It's sickening. Nothing ever changed until the BS retakes control, so when I say "divorce them", what I really mean is "retake control of your life, and put time limit on the pain".

so, if you are with an unremorseful spouse, who is hurting you, think about divorcing them. It's an acknowledgement of the reality of the situation you have been forced into. It doesn't have to go the full term, but either way it's a win win situation.

People always say "dont make any rash decisions for six months". But that is assuming both people are back on board. If your spouse is still hurting you by lying, minimising, getting angry or defensive, then no-one expects you to put up with that for six months. you're being emotionally abused. Put a stop to it. Give it a time limit.

I love my wife with all my heart. However, I wish I had started divorce proceedings against her the moment I realised she was not remorseful. We might have made it, we might not, but I would not have been put through six weeks of hell that he left me far more traumatised than the original affair did. If you love them, then be prepared to let them go. It's your best shot at getting them back.

She also shows flashes of anger and rage, when I took her phone and told her I was going to recover the texts she threatened to leave and came up to my face screaming saying I don't have a right to

One more thing. Protect yourself against false DV (domestic violence) claims.

The most common recommendation is to get yourself a VAR (voice activated recorder) and keep it on you at all times simply for (1) being able to keep track of what was said for your own sanity and (2) as a potential insurance policy against false charges. Other than that, do not disclose that you have it and don't plan on using anything that it records for non-personal purposes. Check with your attorney about the legality of using it in your state, so you are fully informed. Others have used a recording app on their phone, kept the home security cameras rolling or even worn a GoPro non-stop.

There have been enough stories of false DV that you should take it seriously. The pattern looks like:

- You try to or do take her phone. She wrestles you for it.

- She takes your phone away. You wrestle her for it.

- She comes at you with fists, a slap or an object and you restrain her.

- In the midst of an argument, she closes distance and you push her back.

It is all baiting you to make contact. But once it is done, she then calls the police. If there is no disproving evidence, it is her word against yours and she wins every single time. You are arrested, she gets a restraining order and you are out of the house until a court date. That can even begin a series of events that culminates in her getting preferential terms for alimony and child support.

Your wife seems stubborn and cunning enough that she could try to pull something like this off. Protect yourself.

y but if I decide to divorce I don't want have to pay her alimony for destroying our marriage. God how I wish adultery voided paying alimony and spousal support.

you said you make the same money...so alimony not likely in play here. You should set up a free consult with a divorce attorney to know where you stand. Knowledge is power.

I'm doing some more digging about the other guy. I'm going to find out for sure if he is divorced or if my wife was lying, with her word I don't know what to believe.

Hire a PI, find out everything you can about this OM.

Your wife is sounding completely screwed up, obviously. She doesnt want to get divorce because she loves you, yet is having sex (most likely) with a co worker.

Find out if he is married, do anything and everything you can to find out. If he is married call his wife. If not, call him and tell him to F off.

Learn everything you can about this OM.

You need to get out of this mess, which means you cannot be on the fence. Talk to a lawyer, file for a divorce and have your wife served. And remember, you can always STOP the divorce at any time.

But her being served will certainly get her out of some nonsense fog.

As for swearing on the Bible or family members graves, we have ALL heard that before only to find there were many more lies.

I just can't help but feeling insecure.

This is the most insidious lie that comes with being betrayed -- that it is somehow a commentary on you. It isn't. It's a commentary on your wife and her character.

Your wife is totally self-centered and is chasing "ego kibbles" because they give her a high. She doesn't care where or how she gets them. It doesn't even really matter who she gets them from. This other guy isn't anything special -- just someone who is similarly engaged and willing to participate in swapping ego kibbles. There is no depth to the relationship. He has absolutely nothing on you and he is not the type of person that is capable of building a lasting relationship, but your wife is blind to all of that right now because --- It is ALL about herself.

The truth is that you are kind, loving, faithful, valuable, worthwhile and important. I know you don't feel that way at the moment, but keep reminding yourself of this truth. It's important for your own healing to get it into your mind and then to allow it to soak into your heart.

personally think he's a downgrade physically.

And that is only the beginning of the list in terms of the ways he is a downgrade.

[This message edited by Crushed7 at 3:31 PM, January 10th (Tuesday)]

From what you indicated , I'd say that it's probably a sexual affair .

You don't have to go through all of this .

Since you're this young and you don't have kids , I'd say letting her go (divorce) is the best option.

I'm doing some more digging about the other guy. I'm going to find out for sure if he is divorced or if my wife was lying, with her word I don't know what to believe. I feel like I'm going to have someone with me to read the texts between them, I just don't think I could stomach it.

I know what he looks like and personally think he's a downgrade physically. I just can't help but feeling insecure. My wife and I were supposed to go to Vegas and stay at the MGM grand before I found out about the affair but I have canceled it and got my money back thankfully. She was furious.

If he's married tell his wife immediately. That will either end the affair or make it incredibly difficult to continue.

If he is divorced then think about letting him know that you are aware he is having an affair with your wife. You have his number. A simple text from you saying "I know about you and my wife" might change the dynamic some. Your call, but if he's divorced I personally would want him to know I'm in the game now. If you do this I wouldn't bother exchanging any communication beyond that text. Send the text and then block the number. You're too emotional right now for a back and forth with the OM.

Everyone else has given you everything you need to know right now. I would just add you need to seriously think about an exit. No kids yet. If she is doing this without kids, it will be 10 times more likely with kids. Young kids are a huge load on a marriage and when most affairs begin. Not saying run but you need to really consider it a possibility.

[This message edited by Chance819 at 3:42 PM, January 10th (Tuesday)]

It's not easy to tell others, I feel humiliated knowing that my wife is having an affair with this asshole.

We limited who we told. Our choice.

But at this point - I think her workplace needs to know. What if this guy is chasing after other married women at the office? HR maybe needs a heads up about him.

I don't want to expose the affair to the workplace because I'm not sure if I will have to pay her alimony even though we make the same if she's jobless. Same reason I don't want her quitting.

I may sound stupid, I just don't know if I want to divorce her right now but I am going to meet with a lawyer since I can't keep watching this happen in front of me. She's acting like a completely different person and it's hard for me to believe this is who she really was all these years, I just don't see it.

We have no kids and we were going to start trying for kids. That is out the window and we have not been intimate since I found out.

Good so far, I also hope you told her she is not accompanying you to your cousin's wedding.

Read up on the 180 in the Healing Library (top left of the page) and implement that ASAP, detach right now.

Get your all your resources in order financially, separate all your money and close all joint bank and credit accounts, get with a lawyer ASAP and follow their advice.

I don't want to expose the affair to the workplace because I'm not sure if I will have to pay her alimony even though we make the same if she's jobless. Same reason I don't want her quitting.

I agree about exposing to the workplace just yet. You need to understand what's going on first. Just start digging. Put together as much information as you can. Ignore your wife for now. Don't tell her what you know. Just gather as much evidence as you can get your hands on. Phone records, texts, emails, facebook, messenger, everything. Subscribe to truthfinder or spokeo. Run some backgrounds on your wife. I be she has some email accounts you didn't know existed.