SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Double Post.

[This message edited by Drumstick at 9:52 AM, June 1st (Friday)]

Joel,

As a trained engineer I do have a methodical and project planning type mind

This will serve you well. It you can detach, you can see the issues objectively and make rational problem solving decisions.

Ironically, to some extent, this is how you wife operated to justify her affair.

Beware the issue I found later when I was years into R, was trying to reconnect but found it hard to re-attach, ( or un-detach, as it were) because that wall of indifference serves as a shield to keep you sane and protected. You can deal with that if you ever get to that bridge.

From your comments, she knows you are discussing this on this site? Is she reading these posts?

[This message edited by twisted at 12:06 PM, June 1st (Friday)]

Mistake No. 1 : Telling her about SI

Haven't read your recent posts, saw the last one, please DO NOT tell your wife about this site.

It's your safe space.

"I finished that book yesterday. It was very insightful and helped me understand a lot. Does your group suggest any others?"

Joel, now would be the time for you to step back from leading her. Observe how she converts her "insight" and "understanding" into actions. Actions specific to how to help you heal. Wait and observe. Or you can sit with her and have her explain her insights and understanding. Her words however are meaningless unless translated into actions.

Providing a reading list sounds innocuous. Doing so is being "helpful" isn't it?. You may be thinking that her asking proves she is engaged and committed. The advantage I see in providing the list is that she won't find SI and your posts by googling "infidelity" or "infidelity books". Just be watchful of what I call the "paint by number" approach. This is where the betrayed spouse does all the leading and heavy lifting for the cheater. The cheater can then simply put a check mark by a box and call it done.

The tone you set now will influence the future. What will your tone be? Will it be the joint decision making you mentioned before? Will it be her having to prove that she deserves to have a place in the M?

Had the pre adultery relationship been one where you fell into the role of "cleaning up" after her? Cleaning up the consequences of her failures to follow through on things for example? Did she "assign" you to do things that were clearly within her wheelhouse? Examine those relationship dynamics. If providing her a reading list fits into those dynamic then I wouldn't do it.

It is not a second thought that her husband would adore her. She has never thought otherwise.

I want to know if the contractor built the mudroom cabinets.

The shot isn’t for cramps. It’s to prevent pregnancy. This was planned so she wouldn’t get pregnant from another man.

Your wife doesn’t have loyalty. Certainly not for you and not for her friend.

This was about being hot and doing what she wanted. You were never to find out.

She loved keeping it under your noses. His wife and you. That was the fun. This is who she is.

This is very insightful and you should read it again.

She is going to pull out all the stops to keep you around now.

And it will feel good. It sounds great.

The I am so sorry,

I will never do this again,

he meant nothing,

I was never going to leave you,

I chose you,

you mean everything to me

I will spend the rest of my life proving my love to you

Followed by do you want a BJ.

Use your engineering brain and analyze what she did before she got caught. That will show you the true person she is.

It’s in the WW playbook.

Joel,

What is her family history? Were parents divorced or anything weird going on in her childhood?

I guess I should thank my XWW for the way she handled things. Got caught, fessed up, we got a divorce.

She also was wise enough to choose a vendor from work and not a friend.

Joel's WW chose to have the affair right in front of her spouse. What an exciting time it must have been for her and the AP. What a fool she played you for. And now she's already to make amends.

I say slow down...it's like she just burned down the house and now wants to move back in before the fire trucks are gone. Take time - you need to catch up. She has thought about a possible DDay since she began the affair, you just found out.

Something let her make thousands of choices to bang the friend. She will not figure that out in a week a month or a year. Or OTOH maybe it was just because it was a thrill, no big psychological FOO, you ignored me, or other reasons.

After some WS go over the line and then go way over the next line. Banging in the mudroom while family was home is that next line. Think what was going thru their minds at that time....This sort of intentional "fuck you" reminds me of another WW who sent selfies to her lover first thing every morning hundreds of times. 100% thinking of herself and 0% thought of H or family.

I could probably get over a drunk ONS or maybe a short affair...but bring it home? Nope. (I learned that my XWW introduced me to her AP. That was the end for me, YMMV)

ETA: I hope that SHE is doing some research on how make things "better" not looking to you and this group for all the boxes to "check off". She needs to be all in for any kind of R to work.

[This message edited by MickeyBill2016 at 12:32 PM, June 1st (Friday)]

I would stop calling him your friend. He wasn't obviously. He was a loser who had very little and he wanted what you had. You paid him to work for you. He was an employee. He wanted your life, wasn't smart enough or hard working enough to get it and so he took your wife. He was never your friend.

Joel,

I'm curious if this partially detached state you are experiencing is a defense mechanism that's come about recently or if this is just the way you've always been?

Regardless, I think you are doing as well as anyone could hope for. Keep taking care of yourself and make sure to be kind when you do it. None of this is your fault so try not to let guilt creep into your thoughts and add to the problem.

If Joel is trying to head for or even consider R, I'm not sure how harping on what his wife did being much "worse" than other aspects and cases of infidelity is going to be all that helpful to his healing. I'm not saying that doesn't matter but it's been stated clearly enough that I don't think he'll overlook it if he was going to.

For me, the marital bed thing wasn't as big a deal as it clearly is for some others. It sucked sure but pretty much all of it does. There were other probably insignificant things to most that crushed me as well.

Isn't there a saying that the worst A is the A that happens to you? or something along those lines?

Isn't there a saying that the worst A is the A that happens to you?

Yea it's like when someone has "minor" surgery. It is minor because it was happening to them not you.

Given:

-The birth control shot ahead of time. (Nice of her to let her husband pay for that)

-The sex in the house with her husband and the kids around.

-And the abject joy of getting away with it (as shown in the texting)

It is going to be very hard for her to employ the “compartmentalization” explaination that most WW usually fall back on around here.

Engaging the BS into the affair, for the sole purpose of increasing the excitement. That is a hard one to explain as “Fog.” It reveals a lot about her core character.

This is why it is important to get separation, in some form. The BS needs to be able to process. To deal with the reality that who they married, is not what they appeared to be. It is hard enough to wade thru this swamp without the WS pulling you in whatever direction they think will best serve their interests.

I would stop calling him your friend. He wasn't obviously. He was a loser who had very little and he wanted what you had. You paid him to work for you. He was an employee. He wanted your life, wasn't smart enough or hard working enough to get it and so he took your wife. He was never your friend.

He didn't take your wife. She's not a vase. She is a grown woman who willingly and purposefully chose to cheat on you by having sex with him. She took advantage of a friend's vulnerable marriage to have risky sex with a man in your house while you were there. This wasn't taken, it was gleefully offered.

The book she should read is the one she finds herself. She needs to put the work in and show commitment.

The best thing you can give her to read is a petition for dissolution of marriage.

Make her win you back. Work on you.

A couple answers to questions 1. no, she is not aware of this site. I told her that I found an online therapy group that is really helping me to see lots of sides of this A. I've shared some the feedback verbally when it was appropriate for our conversation. 2. Her family history. She's an only child. At age 2 her dad was caught in a A. Parents divorced and game over. Her mom worked 2 jobs to put here thru great private schools, loving mother etc. She never knew her dad really, once a year visits until maybe age 16 then not again. her mom has mild bi-polar symptoms, highs and lows along w/fibermyalga (sp). One other thing that I can't overlook - she loves what those 'desperate housewife' shows that a dime a dozen now. I can't stand them. They tend to glorify A and are full of such hatred and relationship conflict. This is one of the new boundaries, no more of that crap. 3. Current actions - yes, she is non stop hugging, committed for life every day every hour to fix us..etc. I do not engage or reply, just listen and then say 'Ok'. I'm executing 180 and working on my self, although it's not my intent, I think she see's hints of my capability of independence. This part is a little personal: I was going for a hike this morning with some friends, they were picking me up on the hour, 15min before the hour she said "there are no kids here and we have a little time, wanna go upstairs?" I told her, "no thanks, I took care of it last night" :-)

Good for you Joel, I bet that made her think for a minute because no one has ever said that to her before...

Was it a little triggery for you- as that was probably said between her and her AP...?

[This message edited by MickeyBill2016 at 12:15 PM, June 2nd (Saturday)]

I see similarities between you story and mine. Both were with partners that were never going to replace us as the safe marriage partner, which made it safe for them to engage. In their minds the affair isn’t so bad if emotions aren’t involved

The other thing is it took place in your house, even worse as you were there. I get how affairs can happen. In the workplace too people become close. A personal trainer who is touching you all the time and things cross the line. In those cases you aren’t even part of the equation.

But when it is with a friend or someone your spouse brings around you that is different. This is done to you. The fact she fucked this guy in your house with you so close is a big warning sign. What if you came down and saw them? Why couldn’t they just keep it to the parking lots.

I am not saying that you can’t get over this. But it is going to take some real work to get her to recognize that this wasn’t just for her. It was to fuck you over too by soiling your home.

I never did the work to get over my anger. I was a monster for a year then just shoved it down. Don’t do that. Express the anger and then work through it

I also didn’t give her any real consequences. That was a mistake. Ask her to leave so she knows what life without you would be.

She will promise to be the best wife ever and make it up to you. See what she does. Hold her feet to the fire with these promises.

It’s going to be rough for a while, but ultimately you will get through it

Upfront like most it's a shock and you just want them back.

Later you think about what did I get back and is that what I want?

Better do some long term thinking.

Bring a friend into your home doesn't say much for her.

As you reflect back you will probably realize who the real her is.

I'm thinking that the FOO (Family of origin), a screwed up family in childhood, is this source of spouses doing stupid stuff like this.

Maybe not directly, but it fosters a coping mechanism somewhere that allows them to justify, or compartmentalize there actions.

However, if you offer or suggest that as something to look into and deal with, undoubtably she will latch on to it an as excuse that it really wasn't fault.

I also know several people that have had horrible childhoods that would never do such a thing to their spouse.

Bravo!! I’ll never forget when my WW realized she couldn’t smooth this over with sex. It was at that exact moment she realized she had no cards left to play. She tried to suggest HB as a way to reconnect... I told her to go bond with AP, I could take care of myself.

The nerve of that woman... thinking she could just buy you off with sex. It’ll be tempting, but don’t give in yet. She needs to realize just how badly she fucked up. Having sex with her will make her feel like everything is going to be ok.