The comment above about men and ego kibbles is interesting. I’ve posted in another thread about the concept of men and our tendency to do things for others as a way of showing we value them. If one considers that in context of the fragility of the male sexual ego, its desire to be coddled and stroked, it’s easy to see how and why we as men feel valued by a woman who does these things. This is a prime reason for the fact that sex to men holds such elevated importance.
Back to the kibbles for a moment, I do think it is fair to say that in many affairs, a man and women exchange ego kibbles, but of very different kinds, with the male AP doing and/or saying things to make the female AP feel good about herself, or attractive, desired, or sexy, while the female AP strokes the male AP’s sexual ego, which makes him feel good about himself so that, in turn, he will continue doing things to make the female feel good, etc.
Which brings me back to the sex. Speaking personally, the primary harm a BH feels from a WW’s A sex isn’t because he fears she liked the sex more with the AP (although if that were the case it would hurt), or that she found him more physically desirable (again, if that were true it would hurt), but that she valued what he was giving her enough to invest her time and energy and resources into giving him sexual pleasure.
There are many WW threads here where the BH feels like he is doing all of the things a loyal husband should do: working hard, bringing home the bacon, killing bugs, moving heavy stuff, and fixing things at home, reminding his wife that he loves her, etc. In addition, there is the reality in so many marriages that once the married couple settles into a rhythm, the wife realizes the husband is going to be reliable and steady and she stops investing energy into stroking her husband’s sexual ego. This is so common it is a trope, where a husband yearns for more sexual fervor from his wife, but tolerates the tepid sex because he believes that’s what good husbands do, and also because usually the tepid sex is explained away by the wife as a natural reduction in sexual desire due to the pressures of life and the effects of aging.
Then along comes an A and the WW takes the bait of the ego kibbles of an illicit lover. We see so many threads here where the BH is gobsmacked on dday, then utterly floored later as he begins to realize the degree to which his WW has been investing energy into giving another man sexual pleasure and stroking his sexual ego, precisely the things the BH has been yearning for and stoically doing without for years.
I think we need to be honest that in a PA, the WW is in fact intending to give her AP sexual pleasure. There are WW’s here who dispute the degree to which the sex was pleasurable or important to them. I do understand this. What we don't see much here are WW’s acknowledging their intent to make their AP feel good sexually. Every woman knows, at an instinctive level, that the path to a man’s heart does not lie through his stomach, it’s about a foot lower. Most WW’s involved in a PA engage in the PA to keep those kibbles coming. This means, among other things, that she means to give the AP sexual pleasure because it will keep him coming back. In this way, the sex was in fact important to her, regardless whether she herself enjoyed it, because of what the sex would yield for her. Giving the AP sexual pleasure becomes a focus of the A. Not the sole focus, perhaps (though there are some A's where sex seems paramount), but definitely a main focus.
For a BH facing this kind of A, the sexual part of the WW’s A is often, possibly usually, the main source of his pain. At the most basic level, even the fact of lying and sneaking to have sex with another man is, for many BH’s, a step up from the level of sexual energy the WW has shown toward him in quite some time. As the level of the A sex increases toward the porn star range, at some point each BH is going to have a threshold where, no matter what the WW does later in an effort to R, the effort is going to feel inauthentic and forced. That threshold is personal and subjective to each man.
To me, Rideitout and Waitedwaytoolong represent the flip sides of two men facing similar levels of betrayal. Again speaking personally, although I’ve not been in their shoes, I suspect my outcome would more likely be that of Waitedwaytoolong than of Rideitout. If I had to browbeat my WW to do sex things with me that she did with her AP – and especially if she had denied these things with me before the A – I cannot conceive of a way that she could convince me that her willingness to thereafter do them with me was authentic or heartfelt. To the BW’s on this thread who might comment that it might not have been authentic or heartfelt by her in her A, I would respond that if she did it voluntarily to get the ego kibbles from the AP, then no matter whether she enjoyed it or even felt degraded by it, it was at least authentic. She gave the AP this because she valued what he gave in return; she denied the BH this because she placed lower value on what he was giving. This may not be how a woman sees it, but it is exactly how a lot of men see it. And again speaking personally, if she had not, prior to the A, valued my attention and support and presence as a husband enough to do those same things, then I cannot conceive of a reason why she would value those aspects of me higher after the A. Any attempt by her to do them would seem tawdry, false, sad.
Bottom line is that almost any WW wishing to R with her BH is going to have to figure out how to overcome that hurdle and convince him that her sexual desire for him is authentic. There is no magic bullet for this. As I say, it is "that ephemeral matter of the heart". I know there are some cases where a WW and a BH reconcile successfully after an A where the WW invested a high degree of sexual energy and brio into the sex part of the A. My perception is that this is rare. On SI, we don’t see the couples where the BH simply tells his WW to sayonara and go back to the AP if that is what she wants. Anecdotally, I’ve known a number of men who did just that, and my own personal makeup is such that this is likely what I would do. There has been a thread or two where I sensed the BH teetering on that brink, almost over the precipice, but by the skin of her teeth the WW was able to convince him, in his heart, that her desire for him is true. The calculus for many men will likely involve some measure of how far into porn fantasyland she ventured with the AP versus how far she had been with the BH before the A. It’s a reality of the difference between men and women and the importance we place on sex, but it is also a difference between men and women in how we perceive the ways in which we show each other that we value each other.
Edited Later:
I think my post above unfairly creates a “Waitedwaytoolong/Rideitout dialectic”, as if there is something diametrically opposed in the nature of the two men that led to their respective outcomes. I didn’t intend that. We often discuss infidelity here on SI as if it exists in a vacuum, but in real life infidelity occurs within the penumbra of the totality of the marriage dynamic. One often sees some version of “An unhappy spouse should either work to save the marriage, or leave it. Cheating is never an acceptable choice.” Platitudes and pontifications. Real life is messy and fraught with conflicting emotion, burdened with dysfunctions such as codependency, addiction, etc. I know there are betrayed spouses who wake up and realize that his or her years of physical abuse, or alcoholism, or emotional distance created a growing distance between him or her and his or her spouse.
Not justifying, just explaining. Back to my point about the R process. That ephemeral matter of the heart. “You gave him more brio/imagination/attention sexually than me; therefore you value him more than me.” The fundamental calculus that takes place in the mind and heart of a large chunk of betrayed men. Many men facing that conclusion then get to: “Alright then, go to him since he is so much better than me. Good riddance.” Some don’t. How does a couple R where the WW showed a significantly stepped up level of sexual brio in her A? It works where the BH believes, in his heart, that his WW, in her heart, truly does desire him more than the AP. The need for a lot of sexual attention by the WW toward the BH is a basic condition for this process to stand even a tiny chance, but sex alone is not sufficient. This is where the “WWTL/RIO” distinction becomes interesting. Somehow, RIO is satisfied, in his heart, that his WW’s desire for him is authentic and true. The heart knows what it knows. Despite the fact that RIO might have the largest SI word count of any poster, we don’t know a lot of specific details of his marriage in terms of the period leading up to the A, how it was discovered, and the process of R. I won’t speculate about those details; I’ll just note that, as I said, the details do matter.
On the flip side, WWTL never found that heart’s belief in the truth of his WW’s authentic desire for him. Again, the heart knows what it knows. The simplest explanation for a thing is often the most likely correct. Perhaps his WW’s heart did not harbor the authentic sexual desire for him that it did for the AP. I do realize that details matter, however, and there were some pretty ugly details in his thread, most notably the way the WW tried to convince WWTL to invest money into a cockamamie business scheme dreamed up by the asshole. Open disrespect toward her BH, in the presence of and in complicity with the AP, in the sanctity of his own home. The level of sheer contempt in that moment is something that I don’t think any couple could overcome.
My point is that, in the end, R works if the heart believes, and it fails if the heart does not. As RIO and others have noted, sex is hugely important to men. I think it’s safe to say that it is a cornerstone of our sense of value as a man. Any WW hoping for even a chance of R would be well advised to take that truth to heart and do everything within her power, stretching the limits of her imagination, to convince her BH that her sexual desire for him is authentic, and strong, and true. If the BH does not believe that, the likelihood of successful R becomes substantially lower.
[This message edited by Butforthegrace at 7:36 AM, March 21st (Thursday)]
