SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Topic pretty much spells it out, but expanding a bit. I think that most women know that crossing the line from an EA to a PA is going to make R much more difficult. And, also, if the 100's of stories here are to be believed, most women aren't really all that enamored with the sex in the A, it's not their primary driver. So, the question, why do it? Why is the axiom we read here "If they were alone in person, they had sex" so often true? If your not out for sex (which many women say) and you know that sex is a huge boundary/issue for many men in R (which I think most women know), why do it? Why is that axiom so often correct?

Is it to keep the A going? If so, doesn't that tell you what you need to know about your AP??

Is it for the fun of sex? If so, that makes perfect sense, but that's not often the story told here by WW's. Many, in fact, say (true or not, I'll never know) that the sex wasn't even that good/great.

Is it to try to draw the male AP closer? If so, makes sense, but to what end? Get him to marry you?

Is it just giving into the M?

Is is that AP's are just so irresistible sexually you can't stop yourself (if so, barf).

Or is it something else entirely? I just don't understand why so many women, women who wouldn't think twice about having a non-sexual relationship with a boyfriend for months, are in bed with AP's on the 1st "date". There's so much more to lose, and, if sex isn't the goal, it seems a terrible risk to take for something that's not all the important/wonderful/fulfilling to many of the WWs who post here. And then, of course, the age old question, why all the kink that seems to pervade an A? Wouldn't sex be enough? You have to do it 15 times a day? Or do stuff that's reserved for the darkest corner of the porn world? I'm asking this question because I really don't understand it; if I had an A, sex would be my primary goal, so I'd spend as little time/effort on the emotional stuff as I could possibly get away with to have the sexy fun time that I wanted from it. Why do so many women seem to claim that the sex wasn't important and yet, their actions during the A are pretty much 90% sexual? And yes, I'm aware that many WW's don't have this experience, but a lot do, and I'd really like to know.. Why?

I'm a guy, so I know you weren't really directing your question at me. But I don't think the 100's of stories here are to be believed. I think they do like the sex. There is just too much shame, guilt, and fear in admitting it openly.

It took my wife a year but she finally admitted to me that she and her other douchebag had a 90-minute porn star session that was, to quote another poster here, "the best sex of her life."

Women enjoy sex just as much as men do. They are human, too. Sex is designed to make us feel good. And I think we've all known women who just use guys for sex and have no actual feelings for them.

I don't see the point in pretending otherwise.

[This message edited by OneLittleVictory at 2:51 PM, June 27th (Wednesday)]

But I don't think the 100's of stories here are to be believed.

I agree with you, but, at the same time, it's really difficult to believe that there are so many people lying, especially on an anon board like this one. When my wife told me the sex wasn't that important to her/that great, I thought "yeah, right, bulls**t". But then I read that dozens, perhaps hundreds of times from other women here, and.. Well, if you hear something enough times, eventually, there has to be some truth to it?

Do you not think most women enjoy sex? Sex with new partner is exciting and exhilarating, it's not fucking rocket surgery. Is it a shock that a woman would be flattered by someone showing sexual interest in them? Especially if she finds that person attractive? Have you never seen a woman use her sexuality to manipulate a man to get something she wants?

Have you never gamed women? Picked up girls in a bar or in a class of some sort? Have you ever had a FWB relationship? You treat those women differently, push sexual boundaries, rush into that aspect of the relationship because you don't see a long term relationship with them - for whatever reason.

You seem to have some set notions about WWs and male APs and I can guarantee you one size does not fit all when it comes to affairs.

Do you not think most women enjoy sex? Sex with new partner is exciting and exhilarating, it's not fucking rocket surgery.

I'm really not sure anymore. Again, there are 100's of stories here and in other places about women who don't really "want" the sexual part of the relationship. Or that's what they claim. The sex wasn't "all that great" and wasn't the driver for them.

You treat those women differently, push sexual boundaries, rush into that aspect of the relationship because you don't see a long term relationship with them - for whatever reason.

Yes, I have no question why guys push for the "good stuff" early in an A. My question is more why the WW's participate in it?

Ok Rideitout, WW here. My A was all about the sex. Literally all. My BH hadn't given me a orgasm in 4 years, and I was given a life-threatening medical diagnosis. I created an OLD profile, never mentioned that I was married, met a man and slept with him 3 times over the course of 6 weeks. I have zero feelings for the AP, and hold nothing against him. I went NC on dday and only think about him when posting here or talking to my H. Women can certainly have sex with no feelings (the same as a man), and can also have feelings without getting physical. Totally depends on the woman. Don't lump us all together.

My WW said the same thing about the sex. She had sex 10 times in 6-7 months with AP she saw daily at work. Most of the encounters were in a truck. He pushed for some acts she did with me but didn't do with him. FWIW, poly confirmed this.

I think she simply whored herself out for attention, compliments, adoration, along with a bunch of lunches, some gifts, and a movie or two. She rationed the pussy to keep the dude on the hook. She was also pissed off at me before she cheated so it was a win win for her. She got to "get back at me" and have another dude dote on her. There was also some new and different sex.

She also drastically underestimated the fallout from cheating.

You treat those women differently, push sexual boundaries, rush into that aspect of the relationship because you don't see a long term relationship with them - for whatever reason.

I've definitely experienced this. The craziest sex I've had has been in NSA type situations, often the first time. Removing the "what will she think of me" from the equation, or not caring about the answer, is very liberating.

Ok Rideitout, WW here. My A was all about the sex. Literally all. My BH hadn't given me a orgasm in 4 years, and I was given a life-threatening medical diagnosis. I created an OLD profile, never mentioned that I was married, met a man and slept with him 3 times over the course of 6 weeks. I have zero feelings for the AP, and hold nothing against him. I went NC on dday and only think about him when posting here or talking to my H. Women can certainly have sex with no feelings (the same as a man), and can also have feelings without getting physical. Totally depends on the woman. Don't lump us all together.

I'm not trying to lump all women together. I am trying to understand why a woman who says "it wasn't about the sex" or "I wasn't after more sex" has sex every spare minute she can with the AP. A relationship that "wasn't about sex" but sex was basically all they did together. No, not all women are the same, you are a great example, you took it physical because you wanted sex. Makes sense. But many women claim that's NOT why they had an A. And that's really want I want to explore, why have the sex if there is so much downside? Honestly, why have an A at all if sex isn't your goal, but, that's a conversation for another thread.

I think she simply whored herself out for attention, compliments, adoration, along with a bunch of lunches, some gifts, and a movie or two.

I'm guessing she said it wasn't for the sex? If so, this is a perfect example. Why have the sex then? I'm pretty sure she could have kept him on the hook with a kiss. Or a HJ. Or some steamy pictures. And caused a LOT less fallout. That's my point, why cross the line if that's not what you're after?

I've definitely experienced this. The craziest sex I've had has been in NSA type situations, often the first time. Removing the "what will she think of me" from the equation, or not caring about the answer, is very liberating.

Me too. But this is the male perspective. In fact, the less I care, the more I am likely to go for the real "crazy stuff". Which explains perfectly why a lot of male AP's push for it. But it doesn't explain why the women agree to it. That's the aspect I don't understand.

[This message edited by Rideitout at 3:21 PM, June 27th (Wednesday)]

Respectfully, Rideitout, I think you're trying too hard to believe the premise.

Respectfully, Rideitout, I think you're trying too hard to believe the premise.

This may be true. But it also means that someone needs to jump on every WW on the board who says "it wasn't about sex" (which some large proportion say) and tell them "your lying to us and yourself". And maybe the answer is that simple. They are all (or the vast majority) lying. Women have A's to get NSA sex, not to get ego kibbles/emotional closeness (in general, again every person is different). That makes sense, but it also means that some large proportion of women are lying. And it's not just here, just Google "why do women have affairs" (as I have many times) and you'll find article after article saying "it's not for sex". Are they all wrong? If you asked me before reading here and those articles for many months I'd say, yes, they are. But now, the preponderance of evidence says that most female A's aren't for more sex. Maybe all that evidence is wrong. The first female poster in this thread shows that at least some female A's are, in fact, for sex. We'll have to see how it develops.

[This message edited by Rideitout at 3:27 PM, June 27th (Wednesday)]

Ah, I think I can help. See it wasn't about the sex because sex is not a socially acceptable thing to want. So it was about the "passion". Which the the socially acceptable female description of sex.

My 2 cents anyway.

My AP was an ex and he and I had an incredible sex life during our relationship, so of course it was one of the components of the affair that I enjoyed and wanted to happen. Because of our past history together, sex for us was bonding and loving as well as feeling physically good as well.

I agree that the whole premise of this is off.

In business, we used to laugh when someone said "it wasn't about the money." It was almost always about the money. Just because the WW comes here and says the sex wasn't the driver, doesn't make it true. In some cases their BS are reading here so it is partially for show, and probably in some cases in retrospect they actually believe it. I know my EX views the sex now in a different light than she did at the time. For her it was all about the sex and how it made her feel young and desirable again. She was also one of the ones that went all in and basically did anything this guy asked. She truly became this guys whore.

I agree with the comments on the NSA sex. I am single now and and I can tell you it is really fun. Not that I don't miss the intimacy we once had, I do. But having a partner that is new, not looking for a commitment beyond what we are doing, is exciting. I am also dating woman that are older and they are looking for fun also. None of the dance that I had to go through when I was dating (ugh Im old), but over 30 years ago. Most likely it will be like eating ice-cream all the time and I will tire of it, but most affairs are the same and not permanent so the partners don't have a chance to tire of it.

BTW, it not just the WW that should be singled out. The guys are just the same. Sex is the motivating factor for them too.

My WW said the sex was nothing special, just part of the overall feeling of a whirlwind romance she got sucked into. She claims it was enjoyable, but no more than when we do it. My wife has never been an overly sexual person in the 12 years we’ve been banging... maybe the first 2 years I guess. I could believe that their sex was not the main focus for her.

Then again, I also could believe that for the first time in years he got her motor running in ways I couldn’t possibly. I just don’t know, I wasn’t there. I’m sure everybody minimizes their A sex to some degree. I minimize my sexual past when discussing it with my wife.

.. my WW told me it was about the power and control and also the illicitness of their A.

..makes me sick, even after all the time that has gone by..

smy

I think that in order to salvage something, they will say anything.

How likely is it that a BH will stick around if their WW admits it was about the sex and they loved every minute of it? Loved doing things for the AP they do not do with their BH?

Self preservation takes precedence.

Rideitout, you more than anyone on this board knows exactly what's going on . Ironically, I read a few threads last night and periodically would come across one that depicted the male mindset perfectly and you would often be that poster. You're spot on concerning the male thinking and motives. There are a few on here that have chased a few women in there day. I know them when I see them because I used to be one. From my readings, you weren't too far behind.

But anyway, you know as I do, many men know how to get to "yes", or "okay" when asking for sex. The lies, disposition, availability and sincerity that is shown by a man, can get a ready/vulnerable woman to remove her clothes, with remarkable ease at times. Sometimes, a woman who is not vulnerable, but with loose boundaries will comply if the guy has a remarkable presence or trait. One common denominator however, is that the woman is ALWAYS in control. Nothing happens without their cooperation and consent. Nothing.

Bottom line though is the some men will be what they need to be to get what they want and either the woman is unaware of this false sincerity or fools herself into thinking he's sincere and special, but really knowing full well he isn't so that the "he fooled me" card is available to them. Regardless, it's the nastier side of life and I believe many woman aren't as clueless as they appear.

Now, I must say that a wife who's been married for 15 years and up and who's never as much as looked at another man, I believe there's a naivety that exist just from not having been in the dating mix for so long. The one's with kids who have put a few pounds on and aren't confident of there attractiveness and not quite feeling sexy. That person is quite vulnerable and depending on how much dating experience she may have had, has no idea that the guy in accounting is a wolf in sheep clothing.Same with a women (or man) who has lost lots of weight and are receiving opposite sex attention for the first time in years or ever.

I'm with you Rideitout. My WW said the sex with her AP was so-so, but then proceeded to have sex with her AP every chance they got during her A, even in our own house and marital bed.

She told me she never thought of leaving me for her AP (who is also a married dude with kids same age as mine), and that I can almost believe.

Passion and sex-wise, I'm now 100% convinced that she must have really enjoyed her A sex. It was exciting and the illicit nature of it was a major additional turn-on. I imagine it would have been like when I first met my WW and had sex with her.

But I don't try get that confession out of her, because I know she will never admit to it. If she ever does admit such a thing, she knows that would leave too much pain to me and she would take a major risk that I'd bail.

Sigh. That's the unfortunate truth. It's been 4 years post DDay now and I've managed to not let that fact bother me every minute of the day. I hope you get there.

I'm guessing she said it wasn't for the sex? If so, this is a perfect example. Why have the sex then? I'm pretty sure she could have kept him on the hook with a kiss. Or a HJ. Or some steamy pictures. And caused a LOT less fallout. That's my point, why cross the line if that's not what you're after?

Oh she definitely said that it wasn't about the sex and I didn't (and don't) believe that shit for one minute. Affair sex is illicit, taboo, forbidden, and she had the "fuck you" to me thing going on too. I can't figure out why she didn't have more sex, she certainly had the opportunity. Who fucking knows. I don't think logic and reason play much into cheating. I've put my WW through hell; I know she had no idea how much fallout there would be. No non-disordered cheater does or they wouldn't do it.

From what she's said, it did start with kissing and progressed from there. I'm sure AP was constantly pushing for sex. Why did she do it? Because she wanted to. There are really no more layers to that onion...

I also don't think most women know how men feel about sex. Those dudes in the friendzone are simply patiently waiting for an opportunity. Some women view sex as a transaction too.