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I'd liken it to buying a Ferrari. You can get one because you like the way they look, or because you like the way they drive, or to impress your same-sex friends, or to impress the opposite sex. Regardless, when you're driving that thing around town it's going to attract attention.

That's a perfect analogy. And you can sit around with your rich friends and bemoan the fact that every time you drive around in your Ferrari people stop and stare. And maybe you really DO hate it (although many who buy a Ferrari are doing is specifically so people will stare at them) but the reality is, a car like that draws a "lot of MF'ing attention". And you have to be ready for it, it's part of the package with a vehicle like that, like it or not (and a lot of the time people buy cars like that, it's because they want that attention from the RIGHT people, read: women), it's just gonna happen. People will ogle it and start at it (and you) non-stop when you roll through town, people will make comments, good and bad (nice car and "f**k you a**hole" are equally common when you drive a very expensive vehicle). People might even do something real stupid like try to take a picture of your car while driving 80MPH on the highway and nearly kill you both. But it's part of the package when you drive something like this, you have to be wildly defensive driving it, and, while you shouldn't (it's everyone else's responsibility to not drive like idiots just because an exotic car comes by) once again, the fact of the matter is, YOU WILL have to drive very defensively because people will "act a fool" when they see your Ferrari rolling through town.

And, lets not forget here, most of the time people stop and stare what they are saying is "that's the most beautiful car I've ever seen". They're not trying to steal the car, they're not trying to hit you, they aren't trying to hurt you or do stupid things. They are just in awe of the vehicle. And a lot of guys looking at women dressed to kill is the same thing. They don't want to rape you, they want to admire. Yes, using the car analogy, I get it, it does get annoying after awhile. Until it's gone that is. See, I used to have a car like that and I'd have told you when I had one "I just want to drive it, please, people stop looking at it and talking to me about it". Now that I don't drive a car like that anymore, you know what? I miss it. I miss the kids snapping pictures from the back of the minivan. The HS kids pulling up next to me and all eyes glued on the car. The reaction of the valet.

I wonder, sometimes, if women feel the same way; when men stop noticing them, do they miss it or are the glad they are finally being treated like "everyone else"? I would have told you that's what I wanted (just treat it like any other car), but now that I have that... It was kind of fun to be the object of desire/lust/dreams at every stop light.

And, cheatstroke, when they invent the male androids with vibrating penises, I guess you guys are out of luck as well.

Because that's all humans are to one another. Genitals. Not people.

DevastatedDee

If Gynoids were to ever become a reality, I don't think they would replace women for men. I think they would just replace women for sex, but only if the man wanted more sex and the woman did not, or if the man was not in a relationship by choice or otherwise.

I think it could result in a significant reduction in the ever-expanding group of men who think they don't get enough sex and decide to become cheating fucking assholes, destroying the lives of BW's, BH's and their children.

That sounds like a really great thing for society, no? The divorce rate would likely plummet.

But, as RIO pointed out, that could be a good thing, it could be a terrible thing. There's no way to know.

Why are so many of the threads that involve male vs female mentality just clusters?

I think it could result in a significant reduction in the ever-expanding group of men who think they don't get enough sex and decide to become cheating fucking assholes, destroying the lives of BW's, BH's and their children.

Never thought of that one, but, I suspect your right. In fact, that's probably the easiest to predict thing for what would happen, the cheating rate would fall off a cliff because, at least in the group of men I know, take away the drive for sex, you take away the cheating with it. And if the drive for sex is entirely subjugated to robots, well.. Not a whole lot of reason to blow up your life anymore, is there?

It's kind of like the singularity, you really can't "see past it", because we just can't accurately predict what will happen. We have indicators (like I mentioned before) but we really do not know. Could be a panacea for both sexes, women no longer feeling pressured for sex and men having all the "sex" (robotic) their heart desires. Could be, quite literally, the beginning of the end for the human race (because men disengage with women to a degree that the birth rate plummets to the "point of no return"). Even if not that dire, it could result in a world 1000 years from now with drastically fewer people in it because of the birth rate dropping so precipitously.

I wonder, sometimes, if women feel the same way; when men stop noticing them, do they miss it or are the glad they are finally being treated like "everyone else"? I would have told you that's what I wanted (just treat it like any other car), but now that I have that... It was kind of fun to be the object of desire/lust/dreams at every stop light.

This is something that has actually been written about a fair bit by professional women. Basically, they get to a certain age where they're no longer the hot young thing and suddenly men pay them a great deal less attention. Perhaps some prefer it that way, but most of what I've seen is complaining about feeling invisible. All I have to say about that is, welcome to how life has always been for almost every man who doesn't look like Hugh Jackman. Enjoy your stay.

I wonder, sometimes, if women feel the same way; when men stop noticing them, do they miss it or are the glad they are finally being treated like "everyone else"?

Speaking for myself only, no, I wouldn't/won't miss it. I despise attention, whether it is an admiring glance from a man at my person or an admiring look at one of my vehicles. See, I've got one of those "looker" vehicles. It was my DS's, and I drive it periodically and keep it up so it is not just a lawn ornament, rusting away in my yard. I get those "looks" and comments routinely. Actually, I get offers to buy it on a regular basis. But this:

It was kind of fun to be the object of desire/lust/dreams at every stop light

is where we differ. To me it is not fun to be the object of attention. I don't enjoy it. I don't secretly smile in pride. None of that. I would truly rather NOT have that attention, and that's one reason why I don't drive it very often. Well, that and the horrible gas mileage, but that's another story. Just as I don't secretly *delight* in admiring glances from men. That is part of being an introvert, I suppose. I avoid the spotlight whenever possible. But that doesn't mean I'm going to change my choice of clothing and start wearing something I thought would make me invisible. I just ignore looks, comments, whatever because I can't control what others think or say. And if I sound like a bitch for ignoring an unwanted comment, so be it. People can think/say whatever they want, but that doesn't mean my choice of attire was selected to elicit those thoughts. That's on them. Same with the vehicle. I don't drive it for attention.

I dress appropriate for the occasion...I never dress for men...I never dress "sexy" with exposure...

I believe if your attractive...its going to show no matter what garment you wear...you don't have to expose yourself...I have never been comfortable with low low cuts...I like people to look me in the eye...

I like to feel like I look nice...I like to think the fit is well tailored...but comfortable...I want to feel confident...

I could never figure out WH...HE seemed to enjoy others in sexy low cut clothes...he would literally panic, if I was dressed in anything showy...he wanted me to change...He was upset the first time I put on yoga pants...he was nice, but asked me not to wear them outside. double standard much? He never controlled my clothes...he would show fear.. He felt even a bra strap showing was not good..

[This message edited by cancuncrushed at 8:07 PM, April 3rd (Wednesday)]

If my teenage daughter is dressed like a Ferrari, she gets harassed constantly. If she's dressed like a Jetta, she just gets harassed occasionally. There is no option where she gets to be incognito. It's a function of her age, gender and natural looks. And no, it isn't "Wow, that young lady is beautiful." It's "Hooo hoo, baby girl, you got that going on. Whatsa matta? C'mon, smile, baby, smile. I'm not good enough for you to smile at? Fuck you, you little bitch." And she's not armed with the evident wealth and power of your Ferrari owner, either. In your example, the "fuck you, asshole" doesn't scare him a bit, because he knows their position is weak. But when they say "fuck you, bitch," she's vulnerable to their size and strength, and they know it.

It's a function of her age, gender and natural looks. And no, it isn't "Wow, that young lady is beautiful." It's "Hooo hoo, baby girl, you got that going on. Whatsa matta? C'mon, smile, baby, smile. I'm not good enough for you to smile at? Fuck you, you little bitch." And she's not armed with the evident wealth and power of your Ferrari owner, either. In your example, the "fuck you, asshole" doesn't scare him a bit, because he knows their position is weak. But when they say "fuck you, bitch," she's vulnerable to their size and strength, and they know it.

Well, let me say, if I take an expensive car into the wrong neighborhood (which this sounds like to me), it's pretty much exactly the same thing. And I'm just as venerable to their guns, size or not, bullets stop all of us pretty equally. Now, yes, in a car I'm a little more insulated, but there are a lot of places that are a "no go" with an expensive vehicle. Shoot, there are a lot of places that are a "no go" as a white man too. And, it sounds like that's the experience she's having, you roll into the hood or the middle of a rough neighborhood in an expensive car, an attractive woman, or a man dressed in a suit, your gonna have a problem.

I'll reiterate, you SHOULD be able to drive safely through the hood in a 300K car, and a woman shoudl be able to walk safely through the hood in a mini-skirt at 3AM. But, that's not reality, and it's got very little to do with being a woman and much more to do with certain areas in the US are statistically more dangerous that active warzones.

I'll let someone else call that out.

I went through a phase in my teens when I tried to dress as unattractively as possible. I was tired of being harrassed, having my body grabbed, and being pinned to lockers. That was in school, btw. It didn't help. I was still harrassed.

RIO, you get it. There seems to be this assumption that being male somehow makes me immune to violence, as if there's no such thing as knives or guns or even just groups of men targeting individuals. Men get mugged, jumped, even killed all the time and being male doesn't do anything to prevent it.

Sure, you should be able to go out in a miniskirt and heels and not get harassed or assaulted, just like you should be able to leave your house unlocked with the doors and windows open and not get robbed, but that's not the world we live in. The world has always had plenty of fucked up people who do fucked up things. This website exists because of fucked up people who do fucked up things.

There seems to be this assumption that being male somehow makes me immune to violence, as if there's no such thing as knives or guns or even just groups of men targeting individuals. Men get mugged, jumped, even killed all the time and being male doesn't do anything to prevent it.

Where is this assumption? Men are targets of violence. That's not OK. Period. No one's arguing against this. Since when did this become the Pain Olympics?

As for where a person can get sexually harassed - sadly, that happens everywhere. We're not even always talking strangers, some of us had stuff like this happen in our own families. In this case, we're talking about *what we're wearing* being blamed for the harassment. The idea that you have to go to a "bad neighborhood" to be harassed would be laughable if it weren't so damned sad and mistaken.

I think that to some women clothing is like armour. They put on make up and wear certain clothes to create a facade, to give them confidence and it is that confidence that can attract attention. Sometimes it will be intentional, there is no doubt that in specific situations the aim is to attract the attention of a possible or existing partner, however a lot of the time it's simply a by product.

With girls or younger girls you cannot rule out the effect of peer pressure. It can take a while for some women to say, forget it I'm just going to wear what I want! There is tremendous pressure on girls to be fashionable and if the fashion is for mini skirts then that's what they'll gravitate to.

Has anyone else ever watched those videos where dads, brothers, husbands, etc react to the women in their lives getting catcalled?

She was wearing jeans, a long sweater from Target, and no makeup, at 11:30 AM, by a construction site in an upscale neighborhood. But by all means, explain to me again why she should have known it was dangerous to be there, or that the incident was a rare exception, so I can clarify how often it happens.

I think it could result in a significant reduction in the ever-expanding group of men who think they don't get enough sex and decide to become cheating fucking assholes, destroying the lives of BW's, BH's and their children.

Never thought of that one, but, I suspect your right. In fact, that's probably the easiest to predict thing for what would happen, the cheating rate would fall off a cliff because, at least in the group of men I know, take away the drive for sex, you take away the cheating with it. And if the drive for sex is entirely subjugated to robots, well.. Not a whole lot of reason to blow up your life anymore, is there?

It's kind of like the singularity, you really can't "see past it", because we just can't accurately predict what will happen. We have indicators (like I mentioned before) but we really do not know. Could be a panacea for both sexes, women no longer feeling pressured for sex and men having all the "sex" (robotic) their heart desires. Could be, quite literally, the beginning of the end for the human race (because men disengage with women to a degree that the birth rate plummets to the "point of no return"). Even if not that dire, it could result in a world 1000 years from now with drastically fewer people in it because of the birth rate dropping so precipitously.

The climate change solution this planet needs! lol

If Gynoids were to ever become a reality, I don't think they would replace women for men. I think they would just replace women for sex, but only if the man wanted more sex and the woman did not, or if the man was not in a relationship by choice or otherwise.

I think it could result in a significant reduction in the ever-expanding group of men who think they don't get enough sex and decide to become cheating fucking assholes, destroying the lives of BW's, BH's and their children.

That sounds like a really great thing for society, no? The divorce rate would likely plummet.

t/j. But if it was an emotive autonomous entity wouldn’t it still be, at minimum, emotional infidelity? I think of one of my favorite movies of all time, “Her.”

Back on topic. I think threads like this are very valuable and I insightful and give us a great opportunity to learn from one another. I also like to hearing people affected by infidelity wanting to own their power. It’s helpful realize how we can apply some of individual autonomy to put relationships as we heal.

[This message edited by KingRat at 10:04 PM, April 3rd (Wednesday)]

There was an interview a while back on a British tv chat show (This Morning) where a man was interviewed about his sex robot. It was very weird as his wife was also there and if I remember correctly they spoke as though it were actually part of the family.

Oh and if that's not word enough I believe it interacted with their children too, not in a sexual way but in general conversation.

The interview is on YouTube and there were multiple newspaper articles about it (which is where I found out about it). It's extremely creepy and if this is the future then count me out!

Well, let me say, if I take an expensive car into the wrong neighborhood (which this sounds like to me), it's pretty much exactly the same thing.

OMFG NO A MILLION TIMES NO.

And, it sounds like that's the experience she's having, you roll into the hood or the middle of a rough neighborhood in an expensive car, an attractive woman, or a man dressed in a suit, your gonna have a problem.

I live in one of THE most ridiculously liberal hippy PC SWJ neighborhoods in NYC. I'm deadass when I say that people spray paint the word KALE as grafitti around here. The nursery schools ban superhero clothes because they don't want to reinforce gender sterstereotypes and violence.

I HAVE BEEN CATCALLED IN THE MIDDLE OF A SUMMER AFTERNOON WHILE WALKING UP A HILL ON A HOT AF DAY WITH MY TWO KIDS IN TOW. There was literally a small house for sale for THREE POINT FIVE MILLION DOLLARS righr across the street from where it happened.

I'll reiterate, you SHOULD be able to drive safely through the hood in a 300K car, and a woman shoudl be able to walk safely through the hood in a mini-skirt at 3AM. But, that's not reality, and it's got very little to do with being a woman and much more to do with certain areas in the US are statistically more dangerous that active warzones.

Do you know how slimy and scared and angry it makes you feel to have two guys slow their car down to blow you kisses and say "hey maaaa!" in front of your children? Because it's a 90° day and I was wearing short shorts and a very thin silk tank top?

RIO

I get you completely and agree with you.

I’m a woman and when I was young and fit I knew exactly that how I dressed could get reactions from men. Sometimes I like them and other times they get vulgar but ultimately I knew I had to be cognizant where I think it right or wrong.

So Women know that wearing a mini skirt with no underwear is just leading her in one direction and one step closer to possible abuse.

We all have to be responsible for ourselves.

And I understand that we can get abused with no reason.. I too am a CSA survivor abused by family and friends.

And I agree that as I have aged I get less and less looks, etc. I also wear black slacks, black shirts and black blazer with black close-toed shoes. Nothing to look at here boys!!