SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

My 2 cents.

I always like Bigger's advice. What you need to do is remove yourself from infidelity. In a way that creates boundaries and a process, not ultimatums.

I respect the pain and lessons learned provided here, but I would avoid acting in emotional, heavy handed ways. Get a clear, rational *process* going for removing yourself from infidelity.

Look, something that was hard for me to understand, but is discussed in the dozens of books I have read, is that it is hard, especially for women, to extricate themselves quickly from the emotional reality of the affair. It will take time. And you need to establish the distance (the 180) to protect yourself. And start a process to get yourself to a future you want.

So, I guess I am saying that you don't file for D, say fuck you cheater, I want a divorce. I am saying you say that you are initiating a long process by filing that gets you out infidelity and out of sharing WW. Semantics. But important I think.

Plus, you need to tell her family now, not in judgment, but in asking for help. That emotional reality in which your WW is living will crumble if her family knows. Exposure lets in a big ray of the light of truth.

[This message edited by MC_Jack at 10:27 AM, August 20th (Wednesday)]

Luke exposing the affair usually makes both parties squirm and defensive.

Tell her family!

At this point what do have to lose?

NOTHING!

[This message edited by Tom67 at 11:42 AM, August 20th (Wednesday)]

Luke:

If you want to save your marriage, expose her to every person possible. ....her parents, HR, her pastor and do it all in one fell swoop. Tell everyone at the same time.

This may or may not break things up, but what do you have to lose.

Also do NOT LET HER MOVE OUT. Also do not YOURSELF move out. She cheated, if you decide to separate, ask her to leave. She cheated.

Your wife is in the affair fog. Some come out some don't.

My waywards OW is still stalking my wayward husband, and attempting to rekindle. He has shown me every text or email she has sent, and she even calls. He no longer answers the phone if he doesn't recognize the number. So, she only gets his voice mail.

My wayward's OW stopped trying to rekindle when I alerted her husban,d but when he filed for divorce her attempts to rekindle started up again with a vengeance

Also, why does your wife need to meet OM for lunch. That's a "no" unless you are with her?

(By the way, every single time I have read about a cheater swearing on someone's grave, or swearing on someone's life, it has turned about to be a lie. Every. Single. Time. "I swear on the lives of our children, I didn't do it!!! I swear on the grave of my dear departed Grammy!!!!" I must have read about cheaters swearing like that about 20 times, and it's always turned out to be a lie. I consider it to be a part of the cheater's script.)

My wayward husband's OW, swore on her kids that she did not cheat, when her own husband found out.

I had proof though..., porn videos starring herself, with her face visible that she had sent to my wayward.

I also had sext texts of the OW sent to my wayward, with her face clearly visible, to show the OWs husband.

So she couldn't realistically lie anymore to her husband, in light of that type of evidence. Right.

Wrong!

Even with that proof positive evidence, she STILL tried to lie and deny. Her husband just wasn't buying it.

One email exchange I saw between the OW and my wayward, when he was caught and he told her he was caught and it was over, is one in which she told him to "deny, deny, deny, deny, deny. Never admit to the affair.

So I do agree that waywards do deny, despite evidence to the contrary.

I didn't read the responses, but I wanted to respond based on your original post and going on by my experience. I hope to help you.

First of, I"m so sorry to hear. Hugs my friend. You came to the right place. I know that feeling of discovering your partner, your best friend, your lover is with someone else. Then to watch them lie to your face and minimize catastrophe is horrible.

My FWW worked with the guy. He was my "friend". Much like you, I had a suspicion. When I caught her, she said it was minimal. Just sexting. To make a long story short, there was a physical affair. I tell you, it all finally ended for those two after she quit her job at the place and I told his BS what was going on. Other wise, despite their promises of ending, it kept on and on and on.

You're a nice guy. Very understanding. I was too. This has scared me. Her reasons are "valid", but not valid enough to destroy her marriage and hurt you to that degree. If you wanna feel sexy, take a selfie and post it on FB and get all the likes. But destroy your home and hurt the one you "love"? Not cool.

Hope my story helps in one way or another. Be good to yourself. Take good care of you.

Luke:

Also, in case you think I am a really mean person.

I only showed the videos and sext texts to the OWs husband because she continued to attempt to rekindle, when my wayward was caught.

At first, I said nothing to the OWs husband, and then, after she continued to attempt to contact my husband, I simply told the OW's husband of the affair, and showed him some email exchanges in which the OW and my wayward talked of the affair.

She then painted me as a crazy jealous wife, to her husband, and insisted it was just a harmless flirtation and they were only friends. But that I was the crazy jealous wife.

That's when I HAD to show him the images.

[This message edited by Luke at 11:23 AM, September 2nd (Tuesday)]

Oh luke:

I am so sorry.

But no, no, no, don't tell her exact transcript or how you got the information.

Perhaps you can just say you know they are still meeting and you know she wants to be with him.

She will likely assume you hired a PI, as did my wayward.

Don't give away your method of gathering evidence, now.

Ask her if she is in love. Watch her reaction.

Sex means different things to different people.

But most people consider an affair sexless if they did not yet have intercourse.

Kissing and fondling, however, is still a sexual affair, and since intent is everything, her intention apparently was to have sex.

If I were a vindictive man, and I am, I'd get a hotel for the night for you and your kids (with a pool so at least they can have fun), make a copy of that recording and place it somewhere she can see and play it when she gets home. Include a note that says your out for the night with the kids (don't say where), their safe, and that you'll be home with them tomorrow to discuss the divorce.

But that's just me.

Luke - so terribly sorry to hear this :-(

About Twitchy's idea - I think it's a great fantasy but my gut says that you shouldn't do it. Maybe something like telling her that you will go on a vacation with the kids for a week some time soon (not sure if you can take vacation) so that she can have a taste how it feels without you. But that could also backfire and she could just use the time to vacation with the male-slut. The vindictive side of me would go ahead and send that note to her company's HR department, though ...

It does sound as if she does a lot of the pursuing. And it sounds as if she's ambivalent at best about ending the affair. What is all that bullshit about 'not to touch you'? Crap! And I understand that it's hard to consider reconciliation if you just heard your wife say that it's unfortunate that the male-slut wasn't there before you. Maybe try to let it cool down a bit before you take action? Definitely talk to the lawyer, maybe already file the divorce? You can still withdraw it if you decide to do that.

Do you know when that Friday meeting is supposed to happen? She said she won't meet him, right? Maybe make an appointment for her and you (e.g. to try out a MC or something else if you have a better idea) at the same time and see what's going to happen?

Wishing you lots of strength!!!

I

'm not sure how to feel. He came too late, meaning after me, and the i promised you something are the most hurtful. I think my heart just got stabbed multiple times again. To me she is the one pursuing.

So, do i tell her about this info. Maybe say i hired a PI and this is the transcript. What should i do? I still love her. Is this the fog? I really thought she loved me. I'm sorry. This is just beyond imagination for being hurtful. Maybe they are meant to be together. I'm talking my attorney later today. What do i do? What do i say with this info to my wife. I mean is there any chance ever that i can reconcile knowing i'm the reason she's not with her soulmate.

Luke, that is actually not bad news. It could be a lot worse. She is ending it. She didn't progress to sex. She didn't say anything bad about you. These are going to be important factors that will make any reconciliation less painful.

The stuff about meeting him too late, that could be true, they could be soulmates, but the most likely situation is that it is more like a teenage infatuation. My wife was the same way and so were a lot of cheaters who get written about here. So a month or two after the affair ends, it's quite possible that she will realize that he never was her soulmate, he was just some guy who wanted in her pants and paid her some attention, and truth is that just about ANY half-decent-looking guy who did the same would have gotten the same reaction from her at this point in her life. Not everyone cheats, but most get into some kind of rut, a boring routine, kids and chores and work and bills, not much time for romance, and you're not really even thinking about it, but then this guy comes along and gives her a little romantic attention, she returns it a little, and pretty soon it escalates. So don't lose hope my friend.

I think at this point you continue on with the divorce. Really, that's the only thing that has pushed her to do this. She would have been happy with being married and cheating for a good long while, by forcing her hand with the divorce it made her take some action. So continue with the divorce. Tell her you will call it off when she proves to you the affair is over. Ask her how does she think she is going to be able to prove that to you. Tell her you know a lot more than you have let on so far, but you are NOT going to give up your sources. But tell her you KNOW.

Also tell her that every day she puts you on the backburner and delays completely ending this thing, you build up more and more resentment. Tell her that you can't help it, but you hope that the resentment doesn't build up to a point that you don't want to even try to reconcile.

It's best if you can tell her all these things and feel like it's true. I felt like they were true when I told my wife the same types of things.

I told my wife that she was free to go with other man, that she should pack up her stuff, and I would even help, and I'd drive her over to other man's house and drop her off. I told her I didn't want her to stay with me if she didn't love me. I told her any divorce settlement would be fair. I told her, if you love me and want me to try to reconcile with you, this is what I need in order to believe you are telling the truth, since you have lied to me for so long: I'm not going to write out all of the conditions in detail, but basically they involved her ending all contact with other man, and doing whatever she could to prove it to me.

Thanks for the reality check, Tigress.

Sorry Luke but that was an angry, knee jerk post. Sometimes these situations still make me angry, even after all these years. Those types of theatrics never help a situation.

The saddest part is your WW is still so clueless about what she's doing and why. It's so frustrating.

What should i do? I still love her. Is this the fog? I really thought she loved me. I'm sorry. This is just beyond imagination for being hurtful. Maybe they are meant to be together. I'm talking my attorney later today.

What do i do?

What do i say with this info to my wife. I mean is there any chance ever that i can reconcile knowing i'm the reason she's not with her soulmate,and knowing she will always burn for someone else. Or, is this the fog you talk about. i'm very confused.

Yes. Reconciliation is possible.

Yes. She is likely in the fog.

All people in affairs burn for each other. Affairs are exciting.

Still, you can save your marriage.

Can you ask her to move into another room instead of sharing your bed?

Can you get her to MC?

She needs to stop contact with the OM. Like yesterday.

She needs to detox from her chemical affair fog.

Meanwhile, see an attorney, ask him to freeze bank accounts. Have your work check depositied into an account in your name only.

Do the 180. Be kind, be polite, but keep your distance. Act somewhat disconnected. Start working out. Start seeing an individual counselor.

Oh and WKh55 had good advice as did so many others.

sending good energy your way.

[This message edited by seethelight at 3:04 PM, August 20th (Wednesday)]

Just one thought on wk55hn's post. To me it sounds as if they haven't had sex yet (whatever their definition of sex is) but your wife seems to offer something 'promised' and it's the guy who declines because it's now 'too late'. Am I interpreting this wrong? When I read the conversation I thought she was offering to end the affair, maybe on Friday, by fulfilling that promise? And that doesn't sound good to me or like something that should give hope ...

Sounds like a soap opera scene.

Oh, i still want to go out on Friday though"

My husband thinks we had sex, but not yet she said. But, i did promise you something."

He said,"i think it's too late for that."

I dont know what to say, it sort of sounds rehearsed or just that nauseating.

Do not leave your house.

Keep your cool and temper in check.

Do you want to try and R after this. Yes, she is in some stupid fantasy fog. But, you never know. The thing is, this guy is single, so she could leave, but doesn't want to.

In this day of divorce, there is not much to keep her from leaving with him, except her kids. Which is a strong reason. So in a sense you are left with wondering what is she really thinking.

You need to decide if you can R or not. For you, today and in the future.

Unless this is rehearsed, I would say they did not have sex. Why would she promise him sex...that is rather odd. Were they waiting for Christmas.

She wants to be friends with him, and cannot. But still wants Friday.

If you want to stay married, your wife does not leave the house on Friday. If anything, that is the day she fulfills her promise...I am only guessing.

If it were me and I wanted to try and R, I would confront her tonight with all of this. Since I think you have enough, have heard enough and it is time this affair ends, immediately.

If financially possibly, she quits her job,

She does not go to work Friday,

She tells or writes this SOB a NC and you see her send it.

The risks will be she then knows you know her every move and she might take the affair underground. But that would mean with the constant worry of you watching.

If it were me again, I might consider contacting the OM myself and putting the fear of God in him. That is not for revenge, just to let him know you really do exist and are fed up with him interfering with your life.

If you cannot R after her words.. then after talking with your lawyer, file divorce papers, have her served, see how she reacts within the time frame before the divorce is actually done.

I recently heard some states have a short window between filing and actual divorce.

Luke, The OM threw a grenade in your marriage, Don't like the affair? Burn it down like a vampire in the daylight. Expose the affair to everyone. Give your wife a dose of reality, ask her if the other Man will let her live there the kids. I'll wager the OM isn't looking for the job and will kick your wife to the curb. That and divorce papers will bring her out of unicorn-land.

Luke,

After listening to that, you can be sure of one thing. YOUR WIFE is going to attempt to initiate sex with this guy on Friday, and she has been having a make out affair with him every morning. Ask her again tonight what happened and she will lie again because on Friday when she attempts to fuck him, she will hope that will entice him to continue.

Tell her you have hired a PI and that is how you know. Don't disclose.the truth about how you know everything.

You are NEVER going to stop this as long as she spends 8-10 hours a day with him, especially since it is her who is the pursuer. If she stays in that job your marriage is over.

She is going to come home and tell you she told him it is over, but she is not going to tell you she is going to try to fuck him on Friday. I would hire a PI or follow her myself if I was you.

You need to have D papers ready to give her on Friday when you tell her you have caught her lying again.

Don't buy into this fog bull shit for women. Practically everyone advising you except one has told you to aggressively blow this thing up. One poster seems to feel you should give her space to come out of her fog and just relax while she continues to lunch with him , lie to you and fuck him.

The quickest way to treat addiction is to cut it off drugs or OM.

Right now you are PLan B . You need to file and either knock her off the fucking fence or let him have her

Similarities with me: My wife called him her soulmate, my wife pursued him, my wife said she never intended to leave me, my wife never said anything bad about me to other man.

Differences with me: When I confronted my wife, she immediately said she would end it, asked me what I wanted her to do, said that whatever it was she would do it.

So, do i tell her about this info. Maybe say i hired a PI and this is the transcript. What should i do?

Tell her whatever you want, but just never tell her how you got the info. Here are some lines I used. "None of your damn business how I found out you are a liar and a cheater." "I'm not going to tell you who my sources are." Stuff like that.

I still love her. Is this the fog?

I'm not a big believer in the fog, but there is some science documented about the different chemicals the brain releases when one is in the "infatuation" stage, that causes people in the initial stages of a relationship to ignore obvious faults of the other and to think they are "in love" when they really don't know each other all that well except superficially. Also look up "limerence." If you want to call it the fog, that's OK, too.

My wife was there, too, but when I told her I was ready to dump her and she should go be with the other man, that reality intruded on her fantasy and made her think, you know, this thing with other man is not very realistic, how is all of this going to work out with the kids and the money, etc. That's why I recommend going through the motions to start the divorce at this point, a dose of reality usually let's them see that the other person wasn't really a "soulmate." I would hold off on telling her parents and siblings at this point, though that would really help her face some reality, too. The reason is that once you tell them you can't untell them, and once the word is out you can't stop them from telling others, and this could be something that makes it harder to reconcile later on, people might treat her differently. If she doesn't end the affair by Friday, then maybe consider telling them.

While in the fantasy of the affair, somehow the cheaters don't usually think about how other people are going to react, also that their new-found love is not going to be all that exciting once they have to start living in reality with custody issues, financial issues, doing chores, etc., just like they had to do in the marriage.

Now, you know some affairs do result in a long happy marriage between the affair partners, but I think it's relatively rare, and I think usually in those cases the cheaters were pretty unhappy in their marriages to begin with. I'm assuming that is not the case with your wife and other man. It doesn't seem to be.

Yes, it is important that you do not tell her how you know what she said today. Tell you did hire a PI. Let her wonder for a change.

If you do want to try to save the marriage, you can tell her you know about Friday, you know she wants sex with him etc and let her go.

Or you tell you she had the chance to end it and she did not. NOW you are going to end this crap and she doesn't leave the house on Friday. Or tomorrow either.

If you let her go and have her followed, she most likely will have sex, you will know, you will have proof, but what that do to your chances of R and getting over this. Hurts it most likely.

I am still baffled by the OM giving up so easy. Seems he would have tried to get that promise.

Where were they talking when this was recorded???

If financially possibly, she quits her job,

She does not go to work Friday,

She tells or writes this SOB a NC and you see her send it.

The risks will be she then knows you know her every move and she might take the affair underground. But that would mean with the constant worry of you watching.

If it were me again, I might consider contacting the OM myself and putting the fear of God in him. That is not for revenge, just to let him know you really do exist and are fed up with him interfering with your life

^^^This.

When I found out about my WH affair, I immediately implemented Shock and Awe. No waffling on my part. He and OW feared my next move. He ended the A on D-Day, they both KNEW I could blow up their worlds meaning a quick phone call to HR. I was not going to allow my WH and OW play a game with my life or my children's lives.

I was not a member of this site at the time. Everyone is basically giving you the same advice. No more Mr. Nice Guy. It does not work.

Meeting him on Friday? Code words for maybe we can still have sex even though my husband found out.

I am so sorry you had to hear their conversation, but now you know the truth. I would not reveal my source....ever.

Oh, i still want to go out on Friday though ... My husband thinks we had sex, but not yet she said. But, i did promise you something.

Luke, just be careful with this Friday sex thing. Yeah, it looks like they just kissed and groped and never had sex, but I've seen it a few times before in cases very similar where they wanted to have sex for the first time before saying goodbye forever. Your wife feels like this is her star-crossed soulmate, so she is going to want to give it up to him before saying goodbye forever, in my opinion. You know, so she can always remember it during the remaining long years of her dutiful commitment to you and your kids.

In my opinion, the soulmates thing will fade fairly fast for her, but if she does wind up having sex with him, it will make it much more difficult for you to get over it, that will take much longer to fade for you. So do what you have to do to prevent it.