SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

I am Pro R, and I gotta say, I just see a lot of words, no action, no plan for action.

It sounds wonderful to hear your Cheater Spouse say, I will never do it again because of the pain it caused you.... but really, that doesn't get to the root of they why.

She needs to give you real reasons, like I will never do this again, because I will never count on another person to make me happy, complete, fulfilled, etc.

I would encourage you to embrace her words with "Cautious Optimism" If you willingly and blindly move forward, you will be happy for a time, only to realize the real work wasn't done, and after a year of purgatory, you happily swept it under the rug, while she held it up for you.

Actions are what counts in this. Please remember that.

She apologized for minimizing the sex with her AP. She thinks about how stupid she was to seek the companionship of this OM.

Fenderguy

The above is basic biology. The goal is to have your children mature to a point where they can reproduce. A woman knows that all of her children are biologically hers no matter who she has sex with. What she needs is a mate that will provide resources and help her children survive.

If a man provides for children who are not biologically his then his genes will die out. He needs to be secure in the fact that his mate’s children are also his.

That’s why men tend to care about the sex act more than woman. Women also care if their mate’s fidelity but it’s a secondary concern.

If her mate finds another female more attractive he might go to her and take his resources with him. This will decrease the survivability of her children. The sex act itself isn’t a big deal as long as he stays with her and provides.

Therefore the sex act tends to be higher on their list of concerns for men. The relationship tends to be higher on the list of concerns for women.

You and your wife fit into this pattern. She’s more upset with herself for seeking companionship with a man who had no intention to ever provide.

[This message edited by Michigan at 10:00 AM, July 25th (Wednesday)]

That’s why men tend to care about the sex act more than woman. Women also care if their mate’s fidelity but it’s a secondary concern.

This type of generalizing about men and women is bullshit. Please stop telling women that they don't care as much about their partners having sex with other people as much as men. Even at the population level, it's probably untrue and even if it were it is really unhelpful. You can dress it up in whatever pseudoscience you want, but it is just a way to minimize women's pain and be misogynistic.

People are traumatized by infidelity for many reasons. Okay, so we don't have to DNA test our offspring. That doesn't make any of this stuff less traumatic.

That’s why men tend to care about the sex act more than woman.

Michigan

This type of generalizing about men and women is bullshit.

rbf1234

I said TEND. Men tend to be taller than women. Do you have a problem with that statement? Is it misogynistic?

Some women are taller than some men. Another true statement.

She apologized for minimizing the sex with her AP. She thinks about how stupid she was to seek the companionship of this OM.

Fenderguy

The OP and his WW fit into this pattern. Telling them that there is a biological basis for their behavior isn't helpful? Understanding where the other person is coming from isn't helpful?

[This message edited by Michigan at 11:08 AM, July 25th (Wednesday)]

I’m sure my wife is probably minimizing the sex. I told her that if I find out she was lying about anything that it would be automatic D. She understands and agrees. She claims she never orgasmed with OM. I believe that I guess, she really doesn’t orgasm with me either. She used to, but I think that after kids her mind is just going a mile a minute and can’t get there. I told her that she needs to look into that. I don’t want her to feel pressured to have an orgasm. But if she never had them, then something is wrong. And no, I don’t think I’m doing it wrong. Obviously shI enjoyed having sex with this guy, I’m not going to pretend she didn’t. I’ve never had sex I didn’t enjoy to some level.

I’ve just decided I need to be more vocal about what I want from our sex life. I’m not one of those guys with a score sheet, where certain acts are worth more than others, and must be done at a certain frequency. But I suppose I need to up the ante a little bit, so she knows I no longer will except the bare minimum from her every time.

TMI but have you asked her if she can orgasm by herself?

May be time to introduce some toys into the bedroom. Hitachi Magic Wand for starters......

Hitachi Magic Wand for starters......

Easy there Pink.... those aren't for beginners!

But you do have a valid point and something that she definitely needs to work on.

If you aren't getting anything out of sex, then why do it? I can see that it would not be something she seeks out.

She claims she hasn’t masturbated in years. I’m not sure why she would lie about that to me, as it’s something I actually would encourage her to do. God knows I do. Ever since our 2nd child was born 5 years ago, her sex drive has plummeted. She is almost prudish now, seems to get offended by sexual humor. It’s almost like she views sex as something kind of immature or juvenile. Which is why her having a PA kind of confuses me. I told her that it seems clear to me that she is not attracted to me, but she was to me. She says that’s ridiculous, but we can’t seem to grasp each other’s thought process on this.

I told her part of the conditions of R are that she looks into this. I told her it’s unacceptable that I am a married man, a good man and a good husband, and I was having a better sex life with my high school girlfriend in the backseat of my car. That seemed to sink in.

Also, she kind of mocks her sister for using sex toys, so I’m sure she probably doesn’t have any:

I told her it’s unacceptable that I am a married man, a good man and a good husband, and I was having a better sex life with my high school girlfriend in the backseat of my car.

This is apparently a thing -- married women abandoning their husbands sexually after they believe they are done having their children. Not saying it's right, by the way. Just that it happens. The woman needs to recall exactly what you said: a good husband who gives his 100% to the family should reasonably expect at least a decent sex life with his wife. Just as she expects him to make an effort, she should too.

I think you are making a lot of excuses for her. She is not a prude. She had an affair, so that just sounds ridiculous.

She feels or has the need to act like a prude with you. Why? I can guarantee she wasn't acting like one with her AP.

She needs to figure out the reason she feels the need to play the prude role with you. Moms, women, all have 1 million things to think about, our minds are always racing. It's not an excuse to detach during sex.

All of it is just a bunch of excuses you are accepting!

That's what I don't get...she can no longer pretend to be this respectable pure wife and mother that would never kneel or spit for a penis.

That perception was ruined when she had the affair.

So crawling in back of the minivan or bent over the work bench to have a quickie with her husband shouldn't be a big deal.

Who is she trying to kid?

Again.... hasn't the perception of being a respectable wife gone out the window here?

It's a shame she is going to lose her M b/c she can't bring out the bad girl she so wants to be with another man.

Sorry man...I hope she figures it out!

Great perspective from Pinkpggy. Please take that to heart. She is not the dreaded team D.

Questions I would have.

1 she talked about not being happy in the marriage, other than being caught cheating what has changed?

2. She had so much in common with AP and not with you. What happens when the kids are gone?

3 She hates the AP for doing to her for doing what she did to you, how does she reconcile this?

4 by what you have told us, my read is she is more concerned about how this as impacted her rather than how er actions impacted you. What is her plan on empathy?

5 Why has she elected to do noting versus researching on how to fix herself her marriage and help you.

Fenderguy, I am sorry everyone is raining on your parade. I’m glad you finally had open communication with your w and you will be able to see for yourself if she is a different person and if she becomes a safe partner. You make your decisions accordingly.

Sometimes you need a break from SI. The opinions, while well intentioned, can derail you. I have been derailed many a night.

I wouldn’t say I’m making excuses for her. Just spelling out the reality. It’s not lost on me that the whole prude thing completely contradicts having an affair. Every single day I am faced with the reality that my wife isn’t sexually attracted to me, but she was to him. I told her that, and she says that’s completely not true. That she wishes she could make me believe that the sex was not that important to her during the affair.

Pink, your typically on point comments hit me square in the balls. I’m sure she wasn’t a prude with that dude. God damn, I just don’t know what to do. I am only 37, I can’t go the rest of my life never having a positive sexual experience again. She said she’s going to try to do better... but we were supposed to have sex tonight. She claimed to be tired and feeling sick. Ok, that’s fine, it happens. But it’s always something. Every fucking day, it’s something. Always something that’s occupying her mind. She’s probably just thinking about what outfits the kids are going to wear next Thursday while I’m fucking her anyway.

I’m clearly on a bit of a rollercoaster right now.

She said she’s going to try to do better... but we were supposed to have sex tonight. She claimed to be tired and feeling sick.

Well, you posted right after me. I’ll say again you can judge for yourself if she becomes a different person. However, this is a very questionable start.

Every single day I am faced with the reality that my wife isn’t sexually attracted to me, but she was to him. I told her that, and she says that’s completely not true. That she wishes she could make me believe that the sex was not that important to her during the affair.

Perhaps you could remind her that you aren't asking her to convince you that A sex was not important to you. What you need her to do is show you that quality sex with you is very important to her.

but we were supposed to have sex tonight. She claimed to be tired and feeling sick. Ok, that’s fine, it happens. But it’s always something. Every fucking day, it’s something.

Remind her also that, even immediately after promising to do better, she failed to do better.

From your description of her, she is a person who can get things done if they are important to her. Not getting sex done suggest that it's not truly important to her.

I would suggest that you don't lose the momentum from this dialogue. She will try to sidestep it and ostrich again. Don't let that happen.

You mention in another post that the 1-year gap put you two sexually out of synch. But I don't think that was the case. You were not in synch even before her A and the gap. You have been dissatisfied with the sex life for a long time. I think you need to make that clear. Otherwise, she will think that returning to that status quo will be sufficient.

[This message edited by Butforthegrace at 7:31 AM, July 26th (Thursday)]

LostHope, perhaps you’re right. I have been derailed.

The whole “she wasn’t being a prude during the A” comment really sent me in a tailspin. It was definitely a slap in the face I needed.

Do you really think she is planning outfits? Does she in reality do this?

Your wife and my husband have much in common sexually. It is mind blowing my husband had sex with another woman. You have no idea! I actually have entertained the thought he was gay. My attorney and our MC thought he needed sex therapy. Having a better sex life was a condition of R for me.

My husband loves to cuddle. I am not kidding. He thinks cuddling is better than sex. He generally needs to orgasm once a week. He never masturbates. Never. The only reason we had sex preaffair was to orgasm. That is it. No feelings, no caressing. Nothing. Preaffair I can count the number of times the sex was mind blowing. My husband never allowed me to give him oral sex never. He let his AP. He came home with bruises on his body from his sex life with her. I think it’s disgusting. He has never been to a strip club. And he doesn’t watch porn. Which I am fine with him refraining from

Personally, I think my husband was molested as a child and has repressed it. So many life reactions, sexual reactions line up with it.

As I said, I believe your wife. It wasn’t about sex. The sex was payment to get the talking. I bet while they were having sex she was thinking of the next opinion she wanted to share with him.

Your wife has a great deal to do. I recommended she starts reading blogs on how to improve her sex life. I don’t want to come down to hard on her. As a woman I think it’s weird she doesn’t want to orgasm. This is weird.

[This message edited by Iwantmyglasses at 10:58 PM, July 25th (Wednesday)]

Fenderguy, are you guys in MC? I don't ask that because I think you have done anything wrong or need to work on something but because you need a professional to hear you and then hold her feet to the fire.

These are tough marital issues but COMMON marital issues, very common! Many a sex life is derailed after kids, and an A on either partner's part may signal a mental barrier in seeing their spouse as a sexual being once the kids come along. You guys may have become so very good at playing parents that she can't see you as anything but. It HAPPENS! The thing is, it can be fixed but you guys need help and she needs to face these tough questions and work through them.

I would say 50% of the couples I know faced a seismic shift in their marital mojo post-kids. If there is no cheating, the couple just suffers in silence. Makes a lot of jokes. People don't confront this like they should. Confront it. With a professional.