SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Older women have so much to offer! On a practical note, It may very well be that for many of us older women( post menopausal), sex HURTS...Men who date / have sex with a lot of women of different ages have likely discovered that sex can be more problematic with older women, because it usually takes more work not to hurt us....Gotta be very careful about positions, foreplay, gentleness, which a garden variety womanizer/cheater / one night stander may not want to bother with..Hence their preference for younger women..

I don’t mean to over generalize, just putting in my two cents as a retired RN..

I know that women can consult specialists to treat the above issues..With that said, the most highly effective treatments available today, involve hormone replacement which comes with a very significant cancer risk..

[This message edited by doggiediva at 6:46 PM, February 4th (Tuesday)]

Incarnate, something about your post caught my eye., so I read it thoroughly..The more I read, the more I was surprised that you are so young..You seem to be a lot like my younger son, share his values...To me your description of your personality and physical attributes sounds pretty darned attractive ..Your post and writing style is well worded and thoughtful..

To all of you who must think I am a whacky nut, I realize that my above post was a very simplistic opinion of why men like younger women.

With that said, I agree that some younger people are old souls and many older people are young souls..A good soul mate or spouse does not have to be from the same generation IMO..

I have never cheated..

I do have a close friend who is 27 years younger than me, male, a different race..We met because we share a mutual love of photography..Even with all of our differences we have more similarities..We met up regularly to go on shoots for the better part of six years..He has since moved back to his home country, but we still stay in touch..

[This message edited by doggiediva at 7:03 PM, February 4th (Tuesday)]

I think it's funny...the younger dudes like older women because they claim they know what they want and afraid to Express that.

I'm more about what I dont want...lol

I joked with a friend a while back about dating younger men and we both agreed, it's like trying to have a conversation with Kelso (Ashton Kutcher) lol! My friend said she went on a date with some kid and she literally cut the date short...there was too much cringe. When they come up to me, I reminisce my mother, and feel I need dig into the bottom of my purse for a stale piece of gum...LMAO! Maybe a quarter for the phone booth (dating myself), so he can call his mom and come pick him up.

It really does feel this way for me.

Yaknow...

I think it would be a good idea for some of the ladies in this thread who are disparaging the young men here to take a close look at how they are speaking about their younger counterparts.

I'm a younger man, according to many of you. I'm 35, which puts me outside of the "1/2 your age plus 7" rule. You want to send me home to my mommy with a pat on the head and a stick of gum.

At 35, I've fathered five children. One of them is a well adjusted, strong willed, intelligent 16 year old. Two of them are nonverbal autistic children who take an insane amount of supervision to keep from hurting/killing themselves. I have been married for 17 years. I've survived my ex's infidelities twice. I dropped out of school in 8th grade to work for a living. I earned my GED myself. I put myself through college. I've owned my own businesses. I've managed 6 stores for years. I have so many trades I am proficient in, there will -never- be a time I cannot find work. I have published six books, and I have two more awaiting publishing. I am a skilled jeweler, woodworker, stoneworker, and blacksmith. I have a degree in business, with a focus on human resource management. I've lived off the grid for ten years, growing my own food, milling my own lumber, building my own house, hauling and filtering my own water.

But because I am a younger man, if I take interest in an older woman who seems confident and driven and direct, I'm still 'just a baby'?

I wonder, then, if perhaps the older generation having criminal disregard for the younger isn't as gender divided as it may be being said.

[This message edited by Incarnate at 1:16 AM, February 5th (Wednesday)]

Incarnate-

You're getting offended by a joke that literally was made to make light of this. I have replied to a lot of your posts and expressed a great deal of empathy. This wasnt directed at you. You, just had me thinking...mostly in terms of the super young ones..you know an exclusive thing, like said before. You said you just end up with women a few years older...not planned, so I would not put you in that camp.

Btw-im 43. I dont think of you as a baby...

[This message edited by DashboardMadonna at 2:14 AM, February 5th (Wednesday)]

At 35, I've fathered five children. . . . . . . . .and filtering my own water.

Wow! I just turned 36 and I was feeling accomplished for taking the trash out on time yesterday. I gotta set my goals a little higher. Lol

Seriously though, that is an impressive list of accomplishments. Being so self driven isn't easy.

Kind of a T/J. Have you had time to enjoy any of that? It sounds exhausting.

I read an article recently entitled

"A Therapist Reveals the Surprising Truth about Older Men Marrying Younger Women,"

By Rachel Lee Glass, MA, CLC. I can't link it, but you can Google it. (Mods, my apologies if I'm not supposed to mention a specific article title. I'm fairly new here.) It's anecdotal but is very interesting in light of this conversation. Spoiler: the therapist explains how if they fail, the reasons they do so weren't what she originally thought.

On a slightly different note, my husband and I were having a discussion not long ago about the types of professions that women find particularly attractive in men. For example, men in uniform (military, police officer, firefighter, even athletes), white collar (doctor, lawyer, business executive, entrepreneur), and blue collar (mechanic, construction worker, etc.). You don't see as many women drawn to hair stylists, sanitation workers, grocery store managers, waiters. At least stereotypically, even though the later are honest, respectable jobs. We couldn't think of many obvious examples if you were to flip genders (except maybe things like model? We were stumped. Feel free to list some of you have ideas.) This is changing as culture shifts, and some men are drawn to career-driven women in particular, but usually only if they're more career-driven themselves. Being physically attractive, friendly, and for some men, witty/educated/confident seems to rank higher in their pursuit of women than career does. This isn't a slam on men or meant to be an insult to women--and again is just a stereotype, not true of every single man or woman--but this difference in preference probably allows the older man/younger woman combo to be more common than the opposite. At least initially, these factors boost the other's ego.

Of course, as a relationship deepens and matures (or an authentic, long term relationship is sought) these initial factors matter less. Shared experiences and interests, values, choosing to love instead of simply looking to get one's own needs met, etc. become more important. These bond people and are a lens through which one views attractiveness. When infidelity fog lifts, they are also significant reasons why some people view a relationship as worth salvaging, particularly wayward spouses. The beer goggles come off. The betrayed suddenly looks a lot better, even if he/she is not the one who changed.

Primal attraction is easy. Long term attraction requires a certain amount of maturity and intimacy.

(Edited for clarity.)

[This message edited by RosesandThorns at 7:01 AM, February 5th (Wednesday)]

Incarnate - very impressed with your accomplishments.

I can tell you that most guys I meet that are your age are only out for one thing - sex. They don’t try to converse or engage or get to know the woman in front of them. I’m not trying to generalize but it’s my experience.

And even though I’m married and wear my wedding ring and I’m not flirty or exposing my assets (lol) - the guys don’t care. It’s about getting sex period.

I have met many men of all ages and had a nice conversation and enjoyed the time spent. They were interesting and intelligent and not looking for one thing b/c they were married or in a relationship.

But I didn’t date a player in my 20s and I wouldn’t start doing that now if I were single.

LOL Neanderthal! Can you have a talk with my 49yo H?

A good soul mate or spouse does not have to be from the same generation IMO..

My soulmate was a young woman more than 10 years younger than me. Her H asked her why she hung out with me since I am so much older. We just clicked. 🤷‍♀️

Incarnate, I agree with you. I don't understand why older people denigrate younger people. It seems to be some sort of rite of passage. I see it more with people in their 40s+ disparaging teenagers. I love teenagers. They are so fun, even with their fouls mouths and their obnoxious behavior! They make me laugh. You can also have really good, deep, meaningful conversations with them if you allow them to talk. They are a lot smarter and more caring than a lot of people give them credit for.

I have an adult son who is almost 29. I think he's pretty awesome, and not just because he's my son. He's thoughtful. He cares about other people. He's not out trolling for sex, lying to get into a woman's pants, or anything like that.

I talk to young men a lot. I like to chat with random people when I'm out and about. I don't find that most want sex. (Maybe I'm not as attractive as I think I am. ) They're usually friendly. Sometimes I can tell they want this crazy lady to shut up and leave them alone. Sometimes we can have a pleasant conversation.

I'm almost 50. I'm a GenXer. I don't give a shit.

Interesting article, Roses, especially since I'm 68.

My WW and I dated for a year before we wed. I was 26 and she was 20 which just makes the half age plus 7 calculation.

I think there needs to be an age adjustment if the formula is used. My age is now 68. Divide by 2 is 34 and plus 7 is 41. I don't know why a 41 year old woman would marry a 68 year old man. There is a good possibility she would be his caretaker in old age.

I think the marriage should provide a blessing for both where this seems it might turn out to be a burden for her. The vows better or worse indicate there could be a burden on one or the other of the couple. Accidents, health issues, etc. can happen. In my view that isn't a burden but the odds in a marriage with such an age difference there being a burden because of the age difference seem quite high.

Anyway, if I ever date and remarry I wonder what an appropriate age difference is. The above formula doesn't seem practical as we get older.

Coconut, they do actually...trust me! I did dog rescue stuff (do) and the men I met years ago, happily (I thought) married mom, no issue. Now I’m divorced and they have come out of the woodwork, even the men I only saw dressed in disgusting poop covered clothes while cleaning a shelter.

Trust me, they ARE seeing YOU. You just have to give them the window, , because they aren’t assholes and if they think you are married they would never try. Because they are not assholes like our cheating husbands.

Get it girl.

Steady - that is a considerate thought about the caretaking. I think it depends. I am always skeptical at first if big age gaps but I do know of one legit, very loving couple with such a gap - actually a few years larger. He had his first child in his sixties and is in his 90s now (he still works on a select basis). he has ample wealth so his wife would not be the only person caring for him and can afford help. He has done pretty well until recently but even then is atypically healthy. i understand that when he was in his late fifties he threw himself into healthy eating and yoga and has taken excellent care. He and his wife are in the same line of work and both seem to share a deep and real bond - she is not a kept woman or anything like that she still works now in her sixties. It is rare but happens. That said, she did sign up for the possibility of big burdens with him aging so much first, but she knew that going in. I am sure the financial security Had to have colored her lens but she does seem to love him very much.

[This message edited by Justsomelady at 8:09 AM, February 5th (Wednesday)]

I'm not really offended, DashboardMadonna. My skin is, really, pretty thick. I just notice that threads tend to devolve into the classic Battle of the Sexes. I've also noticed that, generally speaking, these gender divisions tend to be more consistently coming from generations older than my own. There's also a distinct trend to infantilize the Millennial generation, as if we're out there eating tide pods and taking drive thru orders fresh out of high school. The youngest Millennials are mid 20s to pushing 30 at this point, and the older ones are near 40. The older GenZ people are in their very early 20s.

I don't mean to call you specifically out, DM. I read and appreciate your responses frequently. I have heard similar jokes made by men; "I wouldn't even know how to talk to a younger woman, their heads are all full of Kim Kardashian and Snapchat and Instagram," or "Virgin? Why would I want a virgin? I'd rather have a slutty chick that knew what she was doing!"

... etcetera, etcetera. My main point is that a lot of these statements and positions are being attributed chiefly to men, when, frankly, they are across the gender lines pretty evenly, as far as I've seen. People are people, and there are certainly differences between the genders, but I don't think they are as marked as they are being portrayed (not by any single person, but as a general mood in this thread and on this site).

Many of the features that I'm seeing derided about older men who have an attraction to younger women are being repeated by some of the older women in this thread towards younger men. I mean, men are called shallow, motivated by looks, no other interest, etc, and then older men are derided for being pot-bellied, balding, turkey-necked, etc.

I mean, maybe it's just a little raw for me. When my ex decided to go nuclear, she attacked my weight, my baldness (I've kept my head shaved since I was 25 and my hair thinned aggressively, rather than pretending biology wasn't taking its toll on my hairline), my injuries, and my apparent age (I look older than I am). She attacked my attraction to women older than me, saying it was because I was too unattractive/uninteresting for younger women, so I would have to go after women who had given up, overweight elderly cat-ladies, so on and so forth.

My point is, I just don't see why we have to break other people down, even nameless, faceless demographics, just because we don't have an interest ourselves. I'm not into dudes or large women or most black women. Absolutely nothing against them, I'm just not personally attracted to them. Plenty of other people are. I don't think it's healthy to do so.

I don't think that any of the people in this thread are doing so consciously, like, that they are TRYING to be offensive, but I think it's just a touch insensitive. Like younger women HAVE to have daddy issues to be attracted to older men or older men HAVE to be perverts to be attracted to younger women, or younger men HAVE to have Mommy issues and insecurities to be attracted to older women, or older women HAVE to be faking youth to go after younger men.

Some of the older women with younger men that I've met say that younger men have a youthful energy and enthusiasm that they appreciate and don't see in men their own age. These women were energetic and enthusiastic. I've seen the same with some older men and younger women. Some younger men and women are looking for someone more stable and content to spend their time with. I am firmly of the opinion that, once someone is an adult, they should be free to do what they wish with their lives, provided they do so ethically and morally.

@doggiediva

I am glad that you liked my writing. I am an author, as I mentioned, and I know I have a way with words. I find that communication can overcome most barriers, whether they be cultural, gender, or age based. That base human connection is transcendent, and I adore that.

@Neanderthal

(T/J)I do enjoy my skillset. I find joy in learning and experiencing things, and in exercising the skills I have spent my life developing. I just finished making a new bed from raw materials; I didn't want to sleep in the bed that my ex picked out anymore, so I made my own, and that was satisfying. My business skills come in super handy when doing my own accounting or budgeting, as well as managing my author business, or being able to relate to other business people and discuss the topic intelligently and knowledgeably.

[This message edited by Incarnate at 9:25 AM, February 5th (Wednesday)]

Incarnate, you make excellent points. May I point out once again that your WW is a completely horrible person? I saw a picture you posted of yourself in a different part of the board. There isn't a damned thing wrong with you. Matter of fact, once you take into consideration your intellect, maturity and skill set, you're in the top tier of men any sane woman would want to date.

My opinion of the 26-year-old I had a post-separation fling with is that he was an accomplished young man in the Army, a very capable person and worthy of respect. I absolutely used him in the same ways that he used me for a night, and yet I think no less of him as a man. I didn't feel like his mommy and he didn't feel like a kid.

they aren’t assholes and if they think you are married they would never try. Because they are not assholes like our cheating husbands.

True. I should've said I don't get the feeling they are looking for sex with me. I will still disagree that they are all looking only for sex. My adult son has turned down random sex many times. He has also turned down sex with someone who wanted a relationship. He's not in that mindset right now. That doesn't mean he doesn't find women sexually attractive when he's out about.

Wrt ending up in the caretaker role, my FIL's M turned out the opposite. He's in his mid-70s, I think. His W is in her low 50s. He is quite healthy even though he went through a bout with prostate cancer. She, otoh, has all kinds of ailments that she takes several different meds for. She had surgeries. She claims she can't work. From what I have seen when I have stayed with them, my FIL does the bulk of all the work, including a part-time job during tax season while she spends most of her time in bed. FIL has ended up having to care for his 25 year younger W, which is what we all were afraid of when they announced they were getting married.

Edited for typo

[This message edited by cocoplus5nuts at 1:15 PM, February 5th (Wednesday)]

I know of a few like that, too, Justsomelady. One in particular had a 20 year age gap. They had 5 children and a happy life. They were not wealthy by any means but were content. They had a lot of years together.

At my age I don't know why a 41 year old woman would be interested in me. I'm in pretty good shape and, as of yet, haven't had any symptoms of dementia (I don't think) but when I'm 78 she'll be 51. I would suggest she look at her life in 10 and 20 years and what it might look like.

I don't know that I will ever date again or get married. I don't know what an appropriate age would be but don't think the formula provides a very good guideline at my age (for the woman).

ETA: Started this much earlier and just finished it so missed Coconut's post. That can happen, too. What I find repulsive is when something happens to one of the spouses after the marriage that affects them and the "healthy" spouse abandons. Also, if you enter a relationship with a known issue and a prognosis of worsening condition then, IMO, you went into it with eyes wide open and need to live up to your vows. JMO.

[This message edited by steadychevy at 11:12 AM, February 5th (Wednesday)]

Steadychevy, that's a very thoughtful approach. I don't know that there is a formula or "right" age. It seems as though it would be harder to have an emotional connection that felt balanced--instead of a parent/child dynamic--in a relationship where there is a generational age gap (20 yrs or more?). Though people do not all enter the various stages of life at the same numerical age; some women start families in their early 20s, for example, while some wait until their late 30s. I suspect some younger women might not feel short changed by having to care for an older husband because they view it as a part of the package. A calculated risk. Even an act of love, if you will. Others might grow resentful. The important thing would be to work through that possibility before getting married, being real and honest about it. Eyes wide open. As you suggested, once you say the vows, they should mean something. They're promises, not suggestions. I don't understand how some people can treat them as the later.

[This message edited by RosesandThorns at 11:53 AM, February 5th (Wednesday)]

This much I know to be a fact: The Gala apple is the best apple known to man.

Umm not Loukas. Honeycrisp or nothing.

I don't have an issue with age gap. But when you start creeping into the 20 year old dating a 50 year old... Yeah, I just really do not see what they could possibly have in common.

Incarnate - I do get your point about if they are adults let them live their lives so long as they do so ethically and morally. It's unfortunate that there seem to be a lot of situations with these types of age gaps that are not ethical and moral.

All of that said, this one is triggery for me given my history, so I am not trying to throw the baby out with the bathwater.

Red Delicious all the way!!!!!

Better yet...toffee apple (at that point does the apple really matter hahaha)

I'm fine with whatever people do. I've been called a cradle robber because I'm 9 years older than wh. I have dated older and younger. My ex fiance was ten years older than me. Wh and I just clicked. Age just wasnt a factor at all.

His ow 1 was his age.

Ow2 was older than me.

3 and 4 somewhere in the middle I think.

My cousin married the woman of his dreams and I'm sure she was 20+ years older than him. But he was happier than anyone I have ever known.