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The day after the confrontation she wrote me a letter, it’s fairly long and I’m only giving you the main ideas, at times paraphrasing due to removal of unnecessary or too personal details. Most of it should be read as her talking to me, my comments are on parenthesis.

Again, THIS IS NOT A WORD BY WORD TRANSCRIPTION. Just the main points.

She starts by apologizing and acknowledging she made terrible choices without consulting me, acknowledges she destroyed me and can’t look me in the eye, how ashamed she is, and can’t even imagine how much damage and pain she has caused me. That knowing me she should have known this would never stay in the past.

Then says "If you want to know the truth, if you really want to know it, here it is"

"The beginning was no different from any story that starts badly. You and me having problems at home, each day worse than the previous one (this aligns with the rough patch described in my last post), and a cunning man, a manipulative player trying to make me feel perfect and saying how badly mistreated he was at home. And I believed it."

"Our problems at home grew and he kept saying how I deserved better and I believed him and then you think you feel something for someone else and you and I started talking about separation and I fell, I tried to start a relationship. Then I realized it was wrong and things were not as they said it (??? Who said it? Who said what?) and any attempt of a relationship that could have existed ended and as two grown adults we remained as friends." (Some parts of this section are written in third person, clearly by someone not ready to "own it", someone who can’t reconcile her perceived values with her actions) (let’s call this full EA+PA Season 1)

"After a while, I decided to make an effort and work things between us. You asked me why did I suddenly change, why I decided to put extra effort between us and it wasn’t because you were the convenient one like you say, it was because I realized I loved you and I missed us. And yes, all this is mostly my fault but you know you weren’t as nice as you like to remember. You know how you made me feel, how relentless and humiliating you were, how critical of me you were, but I loved you. (I give her this. I can be a PIA when I’m not OK with something, my superpower is knowing which exact buttons to press to make anyone feel like shit. Never used it intentionally, but it happened) and then you said xxx and did xxx and it was then I realized I never wanted to be with anyone else but you for the rest of my life, that’s when I knew you really loved me and wanted me for life despite your difficult ways" (she describes the thing I did which prompted the 180 change and ended for good the rough patch, I remember that)

And I was happy and yes, OM and I kept being friends. He knew you and I were back at our best and he seemed like a good person who understood I didn’t want a relationship like the one he offered". "My biggest relationship at work was in fact with –subordinate-. He was there when you and I were bad, when I attempted and then ended the relationship with OM. He was the one trying to open my eyes on OM, always saying he was not the person who I thought he was"

"All this time OM kept giving me ideas (work ideas), he suggested the changes on xx and xx and I was good at work, growing and making good choices and I won’t lie, they boosting your ego and making you feel special always felt good" (again, who’s "they"?? OM??)

"then you and I started having problems again. I don’t know if you remember, obviously, like any routine it becomes tedious, and let us say back then I wasn’t mature enough not to care and you were not conscious enough to know when to stop pushing and that honeymoon we had come to an end (I have no recollection of this, gaslighting maybe. This was the few months after the 180 and before deciding to have kids. Makes me think the EA and possibly the PA reignited. Got to dig further) then we started talking about forming a family and everything complicated. You remember we started trying and then went to OBGYN, tests were made and we went to the other doctor and we both saw in his face there was no good news" (I remember it differently as stated in my previous post, gaslighting or maybe since women and men perceive the world differently she saw something I didn’t, who knows) and we decided to keep trying and as time passed we started to feel bad" (By the time she agreed to have kids I had been asking for it for at least 3-4 years with her always saying we weren't ready yet. I do remember feeling anxious about not getting pregnant since I knew I was the one with the problem) "and we were poor back then, we didn’t have money" (true, we were in a bad financial situation, IVF would have been out of the question back then)

"That’s when I made the choice. I know you think I say this to justify myself, to lie. I know you want me to say I did it because I am a whore, but this is what it is, I made the choice to try it, we were obsessed with tracking and I knew which day, which exact moment to do it. (she did know) And I knew that asshole has kids and wasn’t hard to convince, I was foolish and made impulsive decisions and never thought of the consequences. All I wanted was to be a mother and you to be a father. And when it happened we were the happiest people in the world, our world was complete and everything revolved around our family" (let’s refer to this as Season 2)

Talks about the pregnancy and how every night she had nightmares "What if SHSA finds out what I did? What if our boy is born and he doesn’t want him?"

Then talks about how she was remorseful and trying to forgive herself for what she did and her heart melting when the kid was born and she saw me with him (what I regard as the happiest moment of my life). Addresses some things I said during the confrontation in a very convincing way. Says after getting pregnant she was never with anyone else but me. (meaning she was after season's 1 ending and before season 2 beginning??) This last comment along with the "routine" before trying to conceive makes me think seasons 1 & 2 were the same and only, without any breaks. Gotta dig further.

Then goes to talk about OM always suspecting the kid was his but never asking and then learning why, OM was already fucking half the office. Always had multiple things going on at the same time.

"Then you wanted a second kid. You kept saying we were getting older and kid 1 had no family around his age and how all the family he knew would be dead by the time he reached our age. And you know I didn’t want it, you know I didn’t want a second child. I was happy the way we were but you kept insisting" (true, she didn’t want another child) "And I went into panic. What if you started questioning why we couldn’t get pregnant this time? What if you went to get another test done? What if you started getting doubts?" "And I did the stupidest thing I could have ever done but I cannot call it that way because that is my dear kid 2" (let us call this Season 3) "and I think that’s why I spoil him so much and let him do everything he wants with me. (true, I mentioned multiple times how she seems like compensating him for something) I feel guilty. Guilty for never wanting him, guilty for all the sleepless, sad, crying nights I had hating him while I was pregnant but I gave you what you wanted, a second son and a life buddy for kid 1" (Can confirm she wasn’t happy back then) "And I knew by then OM wasn’t a good person but didn’t want to complicate things further by getting someone else involved. I was in panic"

Talks about learning that OM’s wife was pregnant and things starting to complicate, how OM’s wife knew OM was a serial cheater and certain he had an affair going on but it wasn’t with my WW, was someone else at the office but OM’s wife found my W on FB, saw a pic of kid 2 and found a certain resemblance. Went to confront my WW at the office, she denied it, calls, texts, threats night and day followed.

Then talks about the new president of the board (yes, another one, can confirm) at work and the new auditing team, eventually discovering that those 2 new suppliers were not just random recommendations by OM, he was in fact partial owner (confirmed it with someone who worked at the auditing firm back then), then more fraud by those companies was discovered, stealing, etc.
My WW authorized those contracts and process changes. She claims that’s when she understood why OM was always near her, always a friend. She realized he used her and not just for sex. Mentions subordinate as her only friend and support during that time, he knew what she had done (unsure if before or after the fact).

Eventually, OM was fired and got sued. (I verified this with an acquaintance, it’s true) The new president started accusing WW of knowing and being involved in the fraud due to the rumors of her and OM thanks to the OBS scandal at the office. Threats of including her in the lawsuit were made. (Have no doubts about this, I have seen waaaaay worse) OM was calling her nonstop asking WW to make them withdraw the lawsuit because they "have a lot of history together". Claims she felt constantly threatened. WW’s way out of that shitshow was to offer to repay what OM had stolen. She signed away her severance package, took a huge loan (verified this, she still has some 15 months left to pay for it), asked her mother for money, and finally got out of there. I believe this part, I was a management consultant for 18 years before doing what I do now. During my consulting career, I saw things you wouldn’t imagine. This story of a predator/white-collar criminal is mild compared to the things I have witnessed.

This last part kind of explains her original "they are bad people" "they want to destroy our family" "it cost me a lot of money" "I suffered a lot for it" I remember her being in pretty bad shape when she finally got out of that job, mentioned it earlier. Kind of explains too why she wanted to delete all history regarding that place.

Closes this section by saying she needs to keep an eye on them, to make sure they are ok and happy together since they are the kind of people who wouldn’t hesitate to come to our house if they ever felt the need for money or just to mess around with us. (My compass leans towards plausible, I have met people way worse than that, however now it wouldn't have any effect since I already know)

The second half of the letter is about apologizing in all shapes and forms, shame, you deserve better, acknowledging she’s going to hell and needing professional help, and especially, about the kids.

She begs over and over and over again to please don’t kick the kids out of my life, to please keep supporting them BUT not financially, to please keep welcoming them in my house.

She says I can keep everything, I can keep the house, the cars, the savings, the investments, everything. She will sign anything I want, whenever I want, but please don’t kick the kids out of my heart.

****

This is a fraction of the letter, it is 6 A4 pages long.

As a shell, a skeleton, the letter is convincing. It touches all the right spots, matches my perceptions of how things were. Season 1 aligns perfectly with the rough patch, and even though I have doubts things really ended at season 1, the fact is, knowing her behavior while having an active EA+PA may support the idea things really ended there. Her general attitude and the relationship I felt at home matches the story.

There are obviously missing parts, lies by omission, lite attempts at gaslighting, and history rewriting, but like I said, as a general skeleton for "what happened", I think it fits.

At present, my main goal is to get a whole picture of what happened so I can process it and eventually archive it so I can move over, that’s why I’m oversharing here, need input.

I know males and females see the world, act, and think differently. What do you think of the story? I have read the letter over and over, dismantling it, analyzing it. Seems authentic enough to me, but what do I know, I’m just a chump.

A WW or fWW input would be highly appreciated too. I know they cannot post here, but if you are a WW and have something to say, don’t hesitate to PM.

A psychiatrist once said I’m not normal, that I process things differently.

My IC said that I "seem to lack a self-preservation instinct."

I kind of see psychiatrist like auto repair technicians. Some really don't need the work and only assume you need something because you came into their office. Most will try to tell you something is wrong with you and at a minimum sign you up for the 50 oil changes package.
Mine once said, "You seem to think that changing my mind on what I think is wrong is you improving." I replied that he didn't understand that I was trying to get him to see things like I did. What ended up helping me way more, was going to the local old folks home and talking through my issues with 3-4 guys twice my age. They all seemed to have really good advice and would try to give me a more long ranged out look on life. Not just focusing on the next 3 months and instead, sometimes look down the line 5-10 years.
If you are in Latin America, go find a dominos game with older guys, bring over some snacks, and drinks. Then sit down and play. Try to give it 2 secessions, then talk about how you want to talk through an issue you have. I'm sure they will hear you out. Retired people are the most under utilized resource around.

I am glad you are heading for divorce. Sorry, your first post after confronting her, made it sound like she pretty much shrugged off your feelings and any concerns for you. She just stated her plan was for a family and that you have to accept things for how they are. I think you don't know everything. She is trying to hold on to the facts to try to save you. My WW did the same thing. I caught her red handed, kissing another guy, and she straight up, tried to convince me it was something else. Let her marinate in her grief and pain. She needs to walk through this valley and get some blisters so walking over the stones in the future won't make her trip and she will know the pain she is signing up for, if she repeats.

I will again say, you taking on any of the "reasons" for her cheating is garbage. If she had any issues with you, there weren't any kids and she could have just left with the new job that was connecting her to her "future".

Be strong. Yes, you logical brain is overriding your emotional brain. Watch out because the logical brain isn't always better.

So she was preyed upon,by a player,and it's his fault. Oh,and yours. And his wife is awful because she realized her husband had an affair with her, because your kid looks like her husband,and confronted her. Right. The OBS is the bad one here.

I see a woman desperately trying to place the blame on everyone else.

Maybe the president of the company thought she was involved with OM,not because OBS made a scene,but, because she WAS involved with OM.

OM is awful,because he was having other affairs,and your wife realized she wasn't special.

No matter what story she comes up with the truth is..she chose to get pregnant by another man, lied to you for the last..what? Decade? And allowed you to believe your kids were your biological kids. She can blame anyone she wants. The facts are enough.

What are your thoughts? Will you be filing for divorce?

Also..let's get it straight. Your wife targeted this man for his sperm. To give her kids. He may be a player..but she is a predator.

Add in that,if what she says is true,and he was cheating with multiple women..she risked your life, by having unprotected sex with this man,and with you.

I'd schedule a polygraph, for my peace of mind,regardless of whether you file for divorce,or not.

[This message edited by HellFire at 7:58 PM, Thursday, February 10th]

Trying for a family was a convenient excuse to fuck AP. I'm not saying this isn't her genuine self-justification. She wanted the affair, the pregnancy was just an excuse. Unilaterally doing this is truly stupid since you could have sought a sperm donor together at a bank through normal means. Not to mention all the other bullshit she went through.

The blameshifting is strong with her (not that it isn't strong with most freshly d-day'd WSs).

I was foolish and made impulsive decisions and never thought of the consequences.

Ya well unfortunately for her those are the kind of life choices that get you divorced.

Her logic / rationalization for the 2nd pregnancy is crazy town. Really twisted thinking. "I gave you what you wanted" Jesus.

And then all the money.

--

OP, you asked us what do we think of it all?

Answer: What a child your wife has been.

So you now have 3 kids to deal with, your 2 sons, and now your wife.

[This message edited by SnowToArmPits at 4:50 AM, Friday, February 11th]

Initial thoughts:

I've never seen a thread where a married woman who was purportedly trying with her husband to get pregnant did this -- secretly had sex with another man for the purpose of getting pregnant, so that her husband would experience being a father. Your WW paints it very much as if she "took one (or two) for the team". As if she is a hero of this narrative in some twisted fashion. And a victim. Hero/victim.

Is she saying that she only had actual PIV intercourse with the AP exactly twice, for the purpose of getting pregnant? It's not clear on that point? It does not feel that this storyline is credible. Or was it an ongoing sexual affair with multiple instances of sex?

Was there one AP, or two? In other words, did she also have an affair with the subordinate? Or was it just with the AP?

As to money, if I understand the letter correctly, your WW is saying that her company accused the AP of theft or embezzlement, the AP implicated your WW, and therefore, to make the matter go away, your WW made the company whole (for the money the AP took)? And she did it because she thought that if it came to a legal matter, she would have to testify about her sex and her children with the AP?

[This message edited by Butforthegrace at 8:48 PM, Thursday, February 10th]

Good position on the kids. I guess time will tell what you decide re your wife. I imagine your subconscious is working overtime on this. Good that you are taking a vacation soon.

A few questions for your attorney ... regardless of what you choose, you need to know the answer to these questions:

1. Can you deny paternity at this point, since you've just been made aware you are not bio-Dad,and be exempt from future child support obligations. (Regardless of if you choose to remain in the children's lives ... it would be better to voluntarily support them rather than be required to support another man's children via court order.)

2. Can you sue OM for back child support for the $$$ you've spent raising his kids and/or to compensate you for future CS, should the court order it?

3. Can you be compensated for the restitution your WW paid for her involvement in the theft at her previous employers through the division of assets in the Property Settlement Agreement? (i.e. instead of a 50/50 split, you would receive something more to make up for the amount she has paid/has to pay in restitution.)

One bit of wisdom from the Voice of Experience ... your WW is only offering you this very favorable settlement because she desperately wants something from you, but that will change to vicious self-preservation once the D papers are served on her. Divorce court/negotiations are NOT the place to play nice, in a misguided effort to maintain her cooperation and/or remain friends.

[This message edited by ButAnyway at 8:44 PM, Thursday, February 10th]

Her letter reads like the typical blameshifting nonsense we hear from most waywards - in your case she's had plenty of time to correct this wrong thinking, so it's really more egregious in a way.

Additionally the "cunning man, a manipulative player" is a common trope among wayward wives. It removes their accountability.

It isn't true, and anyway think about it: what she is saying here is that the next cunning, manipulative player who comes along will easily be able to talk her panties off because she's helpless to resist.

Not a ringing endorsement for her mental acuity or ability to remain faithful to you.

Hey man! First of, I’ll say I’m sorry for what you’re going through... The cheating is one thing; which I can relate to cause I’ve been there, and it’s been the worst experience of my life...

I’ll keep it short as your getting plenty of of advice from others... I’ll just say this; read my story on my profile or my thread somewhere on here "2+ years feels like yesterday " for all the details...

All I’m gonna say is that if she’s willing right now to sign everything to you, do it... If she’s committed to R, it won’t matter in the future... All it will do is give you options... this sh!t doesn’t go away... as a matter of fact, it gets worst over time when you get out of the fog... so if anything, getting everything to your name now gives you options in the future...

I lost that opportunity 2 + years ago and I realize today how it woulda been a life changer...

Best of luck; feel free to private message me...

Sounds like she’s in the guilt/regret phase, and is in an conciliatory mood. Use those to your advantage. Strike while the iron is hot and get the divorce done fast as possible.

Later she may strike a more combative tone.

You’re probably correct about her version of the events, as it aligns with what you recall.

However, the bottom line is that she willingly had an Affair. She had her A before she concocted her brilliant plan to have sex with the OM to get pregnant.

One question to find out is how many times did she have sex with the OM, during the first round of the A which was strictly for fun, then the second round of the A which was strictly for the business of procreation.

Your wife’s best buddy at the office was a male subordinate. She confided in him everything about your life, marriage, and OM. That my friend is called a textbook EA.

The EA with her subordinate and her A equals zero boundaries. Add onto that the very shady stuff at the office that she might very well have been complicit in, and this equals a very psychologically damaged woman from the get go, not including the current psychological damage you’re now witnessing.

I don't think the AP was a mastermind. I think your WW did break the rules and probably was worried it would follow her, so she opted for the payback to the company of commissions, bonuses, and maybe some company losses.
Your WW is trying to keep you form talking to the OBS and AP because there was more sex involved. There is always something that the WS thinks is the single feather that will break the horse's back, so she will hold something back. She knows the AP and OBS have more information than you do currently. She is controlling the narrative.
I would ask to see the documentation about her paying back the company. The company would be liable to repay her wages and the taxes she paid on those wages becomes a deduction. Just a heads up on how that works tax wise. Companies hate having employees pay them back for this exact reason. It is usually easier for the company to write off the losses and let the employee go, with a reduced final check. Especially in CA, if your country is anything like CA. I have also worked with the UK and I know they also have similar, employee extortion prevention laws. Otherwise sales guys would be sued for missing sales numbers.
I wonder if she helped pay the lawsuit settlement with the AP. I wonder if she was in deeper than she said and she paid the whole thing off herself.
She could have thought, he is in love with me, or been afraid you would leave her.
She is looking at the affair in the rear view mirror. She will have different feelings and perceptions now, than she did previously.
It is good that she feels this shame, but it will start to change over time. She is offering you money I bet because she worries you will tell everyone what she has done. The only thing she has retained from all of this is her reputation. She is losing her family, her husband, she lost her job, gave away a lot of money, and now is going to lose her only way of even looking herself in the mirror in the future.
She knows what she did. She did not try to have babies with this guy for your sake. You know that right?
That is how the story changed after the fact. She probably was having sex with him regularly, knew she was close to ovulating and he was pushing for it, and she quickly justified things in her head.
The second child, you probably complained about wanting a second child, she stopper birth control, then he pressured her for sex again. He maybe even knew she was trying for a child so he wouldn't have to wrap things up. He might even have had sex with her to really lock in the deals he had with his companies and keep her on the line.
Threaten her with exposure so she has to sleep with him, but she comes back because she has to make this more than an affair to hold together the paper thin shred of morality she hiding behind.

Now to you being a jerk. I would love to see how big of a jerk you were to drive her to have an affair and 2 children with another man, while married to you. She probably even introduced you to the other man, am I right?
Yeah, she was a head case back then. I'm sorry, but she gave up on the marriage long before you ever did. It was even before the EA because she had those loose boundaries that were waiting for someone to ask. She knew what she was doing. Every WS thinks they know what is best for the marriage. That is why they think they can maintain 2 relationships without either one being hurt. They know they are lying. The thing is, they first lie to themselves, then to everyone else, finally to their spouse after all the practice.
If you aren't even 50 yet, per your timelines, you are in a great place if your finances are in order. Don't be afraid to divorce and try not to take everything or hide assets. With all the debt she has, you are just going to end up screwing yourself over and leaving the door open to sue you later when the discovery is proven to have been "inaccurate". My friend forgot to mention to his ExWW that he had a shed with 4 snow mobiles in it. That just cost him $60k for $40k worth of sleds he didn't want to pay on. He sure is mad now, trust me.

I am female and a former betrayed, now divorced. I think you need to post in general or anywhere else as wayward can't post here, if you want their perspective.

I read it as a desperate person trying to blame literally anything and anyone but herself. She is even fishing for sympathy by calling herself a whore, etc.

Her story seems absolutely delusional. She had sex with OM because she wanted to and justified it with all that other crazy stuff.

[This message edited by clouds777 at 10:13 PM, Thursday, February 10th]

Sounds like pretty much everyone at the office knew she was banging POSOM, very common in workplace affairs. On top of her huge betrayal, you are now the victim of financial infidelity, yes you should dig much deeper, there's a very possible chance that she was neck deep involved in the fraud with her boyfriend back then, the company must have had overwhelming proof of her involvement, typically companies don't make such accussations lightly and those are typically made after a thorough audit and a series of interviews.

After such a massive fraud and betrayal, I would take her up on her offer to "sign anything" now, even if you decide to try the daunting efforts required to R under such horrible circumstances, on top of what she did, her selfish and dishonest nature prompted her to double down and then committed financial infidelity, and yes, she's still blameshifting and lying, but I'm glad you know this, a polygraph should be in order, also make sure you read whatever agreement/documents she must have signed and what admissions she made to the company. Lastly, of course she hates OM and OBS, OM used her as another side piece to choose from in the office and OBS learned the truth and confronted her causing a "scandal" (a scandal your WW created herself the second she decided to cheat).

I bet a conversation with the AP's wife would be super enlightening.

Seriously.

Your WW paid the company because she was guilty.

Go give her a call and see what she says. The thing about blackmail...it has no power if you already know and the info isn't a secret. I bet you find out a whole different version of that story.

Anything is possible. People under stress can and will do very bizarre things. Even critical thinkers can do bizarre things with enough pressure.

That being said, the odds would have to be that she was actually in an ongoing affair with this guy. It doesn't make it true but if you had to place a bet... strategically getting pregnant twice with the OM to satisfy your husbqnd's desire for a child without ever discussing options like adoption vs having an ongoing affair that led to pregnancy? I'd bet on the affair 70/30. Plenty of people struggle to get pregnant and there are other options that you would discuss before going to drastic measures. Why not at least discuss the options vs running behind your back to conceive with the OM? I love my husband so much I'm going to betray him to give him what he wants! Does that make sense? Not much.

But like I said, anything is possible.

You seem to be holding up really well SHSA. You are in the discovery phase and for most of us it is brutal and made worse by a pain that cripples us and a shock that leaves us unable to think, let alone act. You seem to, for now, be able to function and keep a somewhat clear head. Amazing.

I won't make any assumptions about your WW, her motives, her actions or whatever. None of us know, I mean, AT ALL, who this woman is or what went down in her life/head. I don't see how it helps you to muddy the waters with theories and assumptions. The facts as you know them are enough. Brutal, brutal facts.

You will keep on with your discovery and the truth will come out. Trust that. Trust yourself.

Shore up your support system and possibly meds as you move through the grief. As well as you're doing, I'd bet you are still in shock. It will wear off. OTOH it can help you see things much more clearly, OTOH it's a killer pain and can trigger a pretty deep depression.

Protect yourself by consulting with an attorney as you said you planned. Protect your kids.

Rooting for you.

I agree with some of the other poster: Her motivation for having sex with the OM was not to conceive. Rather, she was attracted to him. If she merely wanted sperm, she could have obtained it and used a baster or syringe.

I think she is telling the truth. You know for a fact that the other man was fired and sued. It matches exactly with what she said. Furthermore she lost a ton of money to get out from under. You know that for a fact. I have no idea why that man managed to get her to behave the way she did but desperate people do desperate things and it sounds like you have a nasty mouth on you. Sarcasm pretends to be a joke but it is a cruel way to put people down. If this is how you talked to her I can see where somebody sweet talking her could move right in. I don’t like cheating and I make no excuse for it but something compelled your wife to do what she did. It does not make sense but you sit down and decide you’re going to believe her. I think she was distraught enough of the possibility of you two being childless that she took an easy road and once it was done she was caught.

One thing I have learned through many years of working in the family system set up is that none of us come out of this squeaky clean. All of us have damaged other people even in advertently and if you’ve done it because you’re angry then that person has paid the price. What happens in situations like this though is it boomerangs. Your wife backed away from your meanness into the arms of a predator. If you divorce I don’t think you’ll be happy. I think you love your wife and you have loved life the two of you have had with your two children.

There is no easy answer. There is a very bad man out there looking at your money. There is a very angry wife hating your wife. Figuring it all out is going to be hard. I hope you have some outlets to get rid of anger and stress. I hope those two boys will always know who their Dad is. Good luck