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Newest Member: LonelyandUnsure

Just Found Out :
Punch to the Gut

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Teagan ( member #53676) posted at 2:16 PM on Friday, October 14th, 2016

Hi TOC, I always look for your updates so I can live vicariously through your strength!

Anyone familiar with Post-Nuptial Agreement? I have now read about it since my lawyer brought it up to me as something my "99.99999% certain STBXH" would like to offer and discuss further with me and my attorney present. I'm not sure if I should laugh, be offended or feel bad for him. Is this a gift he is trying to give me? After learning what it is, I am wondering what he thinks I need from this. I don't need his money. All I wanted was his love and FIDELITY! Is he trying to buy my forgiveness?

My guess is the purpose of your WH asking for a post-nup is his way to ask you for reconciliation instead of divorce. The whole point of the post-nup is to set hard lines/boundaries in order to make a relationship work - yet have consequences. It is also a testament of faith by the WS to help give BS peace of mind. The post-nup can have other consequences than just financial. If you put in there that if he cheats again he needs to wear a monkey suit everyday to work and he signs it, you have a consequence. While it can never guarantee the WS will not cheat again, it can help the BS feel better about giving the WS a second chance if they are truly remorseful.

I think your situation is different though, bc you have no desire to R - so his post-nup proposal is null. He is trying to save what he destroyed; he probably researched the post-nup as many couples who try to R do this. Since you are going forward w D, just let your attorney convey to your WH that it is imminent, and you are ready to move on without him in your life.

I wouldn't feel insulted by it, he is desperate now to save the M. (shoulda coulda woulda)

Keep posting, you are so inspirational to us!

Me: BS 37
Him: WH 39
Two children: 4 & 5
Married 8 years
D-day: 6/8/16
Passed polygraph 8/1/16

posts: 83   ·   registered: Jun. 15th, 2016
id 7684759
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atalosss ( member #47882) posted at 4:55 PM on Friday, October 14th, 2016

I actually told h that i wanted a postnup because I'm a SAHM and my kids are young. Legally for me it wouldn't hold water here and all i really wanted was the house and the kids to stay with me. It wasn't realistic so I didn't bother but I did get it in writing from him so that I could at least show him what he promised if I decide this is a dealbreaker or he does it again.

For you, yeah it's stupid and really an empty gesture from your h. I wouldn't be insulted he obviously realizes that he's lost the most valuable person in his life. He should have thought of that first. 💕

"You can't ride two horses with one ass" Channel66

posts: 1098   ·   registered: May. 14th, 2015   ·   location: canada
id 7684885
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SpokenFor ( member #48401) posted at 4:57 PM on Friday, October 14th, 2016

Hey TOC,

It sounds like you are doing a great job of keeping energy flowing into this process. The recharging at the spa clearly worked!

The post-nup: he is grasping at straws looking for ways to engage you, to get a chance to prove he can make your life better with him than you would be without him (or with someone else)... he wants to show you he 'gets it', understands that he has shattered your trust, and is willing to put all that he can offer materially on the line in addition to his love.

Yeah, so what would that buy you?

Ok, that is a question only you can answer, and you may not be able to give a good answer until you are further along in the process. He may or not be doing work to fix himself and at this point you may not even care to know about that.

My immediate thought was that this only made sense as a pre-nup if at some future point, post-divorce, you decided to re-marry. Certainly from an emotional perspective that's the way this makes sense, at least to me.

You know better than any of us what you got from him in your marriage that made you a happier, more fulfilled person. You will in time be able to judge if you could get that from him again. You may also find that, since you are an attractive person, you will meet someone else who suits you better than he ever could. You may find that your most fulfilling life going forward is without a permanent partner.

As I've said before, I am very impressed (and happy) that you were able to get to this point, where you have the power over your own happiness and can know with certainty that you are on a path towards attaining it.

posts: 162   ·   registered: Jun. 26th, 2015   ·   location: California
id 7684887
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SadMom75 ( member #51609) posted at 6:31 PM on Friday, October 14th, 2016

Yep, I looked into a post nup but they aren't valid in my state - according to my lawyer. My reason was, as we attempt R, if he's bullshitting me and continuing to cheat, it was not only going to cost him his wife and life, it was going to cost him much of his money too. Sadly, I couldn't do it.

"Betray a friend, and you'll often find
you have ruined yourself"
-Aesop

posts: 699   ·   registered: Feb. 2nd, 2016   ·   location: PA
id 7684953
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LifeisCrazy ( member #38287) posted at 7:23 PM on Friday, October 14th, 2016

TOC - I haven't posted on your thread but I wanted to just make a point. I realize that it's possible that I will be lambasted for this... but so be it.

Why did you husband send those flowers? Why did he float the idea of a post-nuptial agreement? Because he's trying to fight for your marriage!

You know, it's an amazing thing on this forum. When the WS does NOT make an effort then posters are super quick to label them as cake-eating and in need of IC. But when a WS tries - actually tries - it's seen as grasping at straws. Well, of course he's grasping at straws! He realizes that he did something terrible and is trying to save his marriage. Is that so bad?

I have no dog in this fight. You feel that his infidelity is a deal-breaker and you are on the path towards divorce. I have no problem with that. You do whatever is consistent with your values.

However, you should at least recognize that if he did nothing you would be beside yourself. Could you imagine coming home from your spa vacation to see a note tacked to your door that said, "I guess you've decided we're done. Don't ever call me again?!" Could you imagine the uproar a story like that would have caused here on SI?

Look - your husband made an awfully stupid decision... one that he knew would probably cost him his marriage. But you know what? At least he's trying. At least he's fighting for you. At least he's realizing that his actions were terrible and will likely have repercussions for the rest of his life.

Waywards don't often "get it," especially in the beginning. They don't know the best way to act. Or what to say. It's not like you have an affair and on the night table is a copy of "Not Just Friends." Many waywards who realize they made a poor choice try anything they can to right their wrong - even if it comes off the wrong way.

I know you're pissed. But at least give him some credit for doing SOMETHING.

[This message edited by LifeisCrazy at 1:24 PM, October 14th (Friday)]

"Pain is temporary. Quitting is forever."

posts: 689   ·   registered: Jan. 28th, 2013
id 7684999
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 TurnOtherCheek (original poster member #55194) posted at 7:29 PM on Friday, October 14th, 2016

LifeIsCrazy - Eeeeeekkkk! I'll definitely re-read your post when I have more time to absorb it but at the moment, I am not feeling at all charitable towards WH and in a place to give him any credit yet. Flowers? Post-nup? For screwing around on me for months and months? I'm not quite there yet but I do see your point and I do feel badly for those spouses who's waywards show no remorse and are cruel.

Man, this just has me all jumbled up inside but seriously, I do appreciate the sentiments.

Me: BW x 2 - 53
Ist XWH: Married over 17 years, DD and DS (mine)
2nd XH: Also 53, DS (his), 8 yrs together
OW: Pet sitter
D-Day: 9/11/16
Divorced in 60 seconds flat. http://www.survivinginfidelity.com/forums.asp?tid=591733

posts: 441   ·   registered: Sep. 17th, 2016
id 7685006
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PricklePatch ( member #34041) posted at 7:48 PM on Friday, October 14th, 2016

I dont think your wh is in remorse. From his statements he is in a "panic" of regret. It is evident from no cheating was about him. It is clear from bim not immediately stopping when Bob caught him.

I get being a professional woman and having emotions at work is not perceived well. People may say it is okay to have emotions there, but the truth is it is not.

I had a had to have EAP after a life altering event they got very good help for me.

Second gucessing your self is normal. If you never questioned yourself I could see a problem.

Immediately you were carried through a horrible event and your fight to survive came on, now your in safety noT in immediate event and your able to question yourself.

Frankly, if you didnt question yourself I would think you were not human.

BS Fwh

posts: 3267   ·   registered: Nov. 28th, 2011
id 7685027
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devotedman ( member #45441) posted at 8:37 PM on Friday, October 14th, 2016

Sigh, my opinion? Too early on for him to have gotten over the "fog" of being in an affair.

I think that he's panicked at having his life upended. After all, he didn't buy on for that, just for some fun and strange on the side and for him to get away with it. I do wonder if he's made that little bargain before? Anyway...

The flowers? Grand, manipulative gesture.

The post-nup? Grand, manipulative gesture to lure you back in.

That panic of having your life upended that he's feeling right now is similar to the panic you probably felt early on. You're still showing some signs of that, possibly, by being willing to listen to the bullshit he is throwing. He's throwing it to see what sticks.

Sure, he didn't want to lose you. This was not an Exit Affair for him, this was a fun-and-games A for him. Now that there are consequences to his _real_ life he's panicking.

So, accept it and stay married if you want, if you decide that that is best for you, but don't accept out of similar thoughts of, "wow, divorce sucks. what could possibly go wrong?"

Do be aware, though, that R takes 2-5 years once the WS pulls their head out of their ass and grand gestures don't indicate that. That's where honesty and accepting his behaviors and the pain that they caused you and acknowledging that calmly indicate true remorse.

Don't mistake panic for remorse. Remorse may come, but it isn't here yet.

IMHO.

[This message edited by devotedman at 2:38 PM, October 14th, 2016 (Friday)]

Me: 2xBS b 1962 xWW after 2 decades, xWGF after almost 1.
Amelia Pond: Who are you?
The Doctor: I don't know yet. I'm still cooking.
ENFP-A. Huh.

posts: 5155   ·   registered: Oct. 30th, 2014   ·   location: Central USA
id 7685080
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ICaughtThem ( member #45041) posted at 9:11 PM on Friday, October 14th, 2016

Look - your husband made an awfully stupid decision.

A multi-month A isn't a decision, it's many decisions over time. One could almost understand a drunken, ONS as a bad decision. But no way in hell is a multi-month A one bad decision. Otherwise, one could argue that a 10 year A was a bad decision because it was only with one AP. Sorry, not buying it.

He wasn't willing to "fight" for the M for several months. Why should he start now?

Advice is what we ask for when we already know the answer but wish we didn’t.

posts: 605   ·   registered: Sep. 29th, 2014   ·   location: USA
id 7685111
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annanew ( member #43693) posted at 9:16 PM on Friday, October 14th, 2016

A post-nup is a great thing for a remorseful spouse to offer. Like a polygraph, it sends a message "I am trying to employ any tool possible to help you feel safe".

Flowers are nothing. I mean I guess they are better than not sending flowers, but it only takes 90 seconds to go online and order flowers. A post-nup can mean real financial consequences for WH should you reconcile and find him cheating again in the future.

But a post-nup in itself is not enough. There needs to be counseling, transparency, real change. And sometimes even that is not enough.

I get every sense you are very strong and that this is a dealbreaker for you. I think you should stick to that. But I just wanted to say that I don't think the post-nup offer is meant to be a trick.

Single mom to a sweet girl.

posts: 2500   ·   registered: Jun. 11th, 2014   ·   location: California
id 7685124
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 TurnOtherCheek (original poster member #55194) posted at 9:27 PM on Friday, October 14th, 2016

Devoted Man:

So, accept it and stay married if you want, if you decide that that is best for you, but don't accept out of similar thoughts of, "wow, divorce sucks. what could possibly go wrong?"

I am not at all thinking of listening to this offer he wants to make. We already had a deal. We took vows. We said cheating was a deal breaker. Deal broken!

I am not thinking of R. I am heading to a divorce. This NC concept is amazing. I get to think about me and only what I want and need without giving a care about how he might be doing, what he's doing or having any of that impact me at all. Yes, sometimes I miss him but more likely I miss the concept of us and the life we had. I liked my life, our life. But he's in a hell of a lot of trouble now because I am at the worse possible place I could be if what he wants is to R. I am indifferent. I'm just "meh" about him right now. MEH!

Me: BW x 2 - 53
Ist XWH: Married over 17 years, DD and DS (mine)
2nd XH: Also 53, DS (his), 8 yrs together
OW: Pet sitter
D-Day: 9/11/16
Divorced in 60 seconds flat. http://www.survivinginfidelity.com/forums.asp?tid=591733

posts: 441   ·   registered: Sep. 17th, 2016
id 7685134
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devotedman ( member #45441) posted at 10:24 PM on Friday, October 14th, 2016

Good for you! Great attitude.

Now, do please remember the roller coaster. When those thoughts come remember, hands, feet, and decisions inside the car at all times.

Me: 2xBS b 1962 xWW after 2 decades, xWGF after almost 1.
Amelia Pond: Who are you?
The Doctor: I don't know yet. I'm still cooking.
ENFP-A. Huh.

posts: 5155   ·   registered: Oct. 30th, 2014   ·   location: Central USA
id 7685180
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Nooneleft ( member #55589) posted at 10:43 PM on Friday, October 14th, 2016

TOC... thank you. Your posting is the reason I joined. Your strength and control has given me something to aim to.

I have read every page. Cried. Related. Drank some wine. And cried a little more.

You restraint and control is what I strive for... instead of my seeing red and breaking my hand on WH face.

Our parents were right. Violence is not the answer.

So anyway thank you. For sharing your terrible story. For reaching out for help like all the rest of us. For inspiring so many.

These are pages of my book I never intended to write...
Me: 34
WH: 37
3 amazing kids 18, 16 and 12!
undecided future.

posts: 466   ·   registered: Oct. 13th, 2016   ·   location: Victoria
id 7685194
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atalosss ( member #47882) posted at 11:52 PM on Friday, October 14th, 2016

Yep, its more likely regret not remorse. Remorse is when they see your devastation and empathize with what they've put you through. I'm sure he regrets a lot of things.

Posters are responding to you this way bc you said that its a dealbreaker! Your wh doesn't need to be patted on the back because he sends you something or offers you something. Its just rediculous to suggest that he should be given credit for trying.

For those of us who discover it isn't a deal breaker and have a spouse who isn't showing the actions of remorse, well the response of SI posters is usually different bc the "gift" of reconciliation has been offered.

Ugh...just do what's right for you, be angry if you want, think he's a pathetic loser if you want. I think you've earned that right!

"You can't ride two horses with one ass" Channel66

posts: 1098   ·   registered: May. 14th, 2015   ·   location: canada
id 7685228
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HearMe ( member #52786) posted at 12:08 AM on Saturday, October 15th, 2016

You don't need him you can take care of yourself financially so a pre-nup is not that big of an incentive.

If it is a deal breaker stay on course.

In the future if your wh has done the work and you're wanting to give him a chance again you guys can talk about a pre-nup then. (Just to make yourself feel safer giving him a chance)

You are truly an inspiration and I'm sorry you're going through this.

[This message edited by HearMe at 6:13 PM, October 14th (Friday)]

posts: 226   ·   registered: Apr. 16th, 2016   ·   location: SoCal
id 7685238
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HardyRose ( member #55069) posted at 12:18 AM on Saturday, October 15th, 2016

I don't think your WH deserves credit for sending flowers and asking about a post nup. If he really saw the damage he had done and valued your marriage he wouldn't have made comments that shifted the blame to you like

"I wish you had just asked me"

because I had figured out a plausible lie about the message that I accidentally sent to your phone. We could have avoided the fall out of my A if you had let me lie to you.

"You are being childish"

Stamps feet in tantrum. How dare you make me feel bad for having an affair. You are mean.

If he wanted to fight for your marriage he would have met you for lunch prepared with the answers you told him you needed. You gave him exactly what you needed to start healing and he didn't put the effort into your marriage then.

you were ment to look into my eyes and fall back into my arms without me doing anything!

And honestly if he wanted to save your marriage he would have stopped when Bob found out.

I am glad you are at Meh about him at the moment. Keep healing and looking after yourself TOC.

Sorry it makes me cross when people imply that the BS is responsible for saving the marriage that their WH threw away and accept empty gestures simply because they were offered.

[This message edited by HardyRose at 6:20 PM, October 14th (Friday)]

posts: 923   ·   registered: Mar. 27th, 2016
id 7685251
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Tearsoflove ( member #8271) posted at 4:22 AM on Saturday, October 15th, 2016

^^^^This. All of it.^^^^

"Just because I don't care doesn't mean I don't understand." ~Homer Simpson

posts: 6078   ·   registered: Sep. 20th, 2005   ·   location: Southeast
id 7685331
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devotedman ( member #45441) posted at 1:52 PM on Saturday, October 15th, 2016

TOC, how are you doing today? This crap is so often day-by-day. How's the dog? The kids? Are you sleeping well? Are you feeling especially delicate or vulnerable emotionally? I ask these things because people often think that they're deficient in some way if they're not supermen during events like these. That's not true. Be sure to treat yourself as well as you'd treat a son, daughter, or friend during a similar event. Be sure to have compassion for TOC.

EAP: They're benefits. You might be covered under your H's company EAP as well. If you are, you might call his HR or Benefits department and, since you're getting divorced, use _those_ benefits before you use yours. Since those appointments are often once-per-week if you get right on all of that you just might be able to use several of those before year-end, say 4, so then you'd get another 6 off of his company for a total of 10 (4 this year, 6 next). Then you could use your 6, perhaps with the same IC, perhaps not.

Mine worked like this: I'd call and ask for a list of ICs who had infidelity, CSA (my own issues), or trauma experience (infidelity first, trauma second), who were male, female, or didn't care, and who were within X miles of me. They then sent me a link to a webpage that I could check at home (away from work web access monitoring) and start getting the ICs.

Like with lawyers, ICs around here offer a short, free consultation. Do not waste this with details of your situation. Ask if the IC believes that the decision to cheat is wholly the decision of the cheater. Some ICs don't "get it" and it has become somewhat chic to lay part of the blame for the cheater's unilateral decision to cheat onto the BS. That is BS. (Heh. Made a BS joke.). Ask, too, if the ICs style is "conversational" or "confrontational". I made the mistake of going with xWGF to talk with an IC who had a confrontational style. I felt attacked, like I was a naughty child again who was about to get beaten bloody all over again. It was so bad that xWGF rose to my defense. I tried to use discussion and dialogue with this IC and the results were just horrible.

In my geographic area that IC-interview/vetting period is about 20 minutes long. Use it to see if you two are a match, ask them how _they_ view things, and you can avoid some problems. In the case above I called my EAP back because I was so shaken and they explained the conversational vs. confrontational style to me. They don't track that for recommendation purposes, but since just about everyone who answers the phone for IC-related stuff has IC training, they encouraged me never to go back to that IC if I didn't feel safe (I didn't) and then credited my 6-per-year count back the 1 visit that I had with the guy.

Oh, and in my opinion, limiting infidelity dialogue/treatment in IC to 6 visits is a ludicrous expectation. The first official meeting with an IC is usually them getting to know you, you situation, your general emotional state, and your expectations for IC. The second meeting is usually the first productive one. Don't expect miracles, counseling takes time.

You have done impressively well treating yourself with respect. You might not realize how important this is to your overall mental outlook, but it is _hugely_ important. You haven't begged, you haven't grovelled, you haven't abased yourself. You have been gentle with yourself, you have called upon the kindness of strangers, you've given yourself permission to cry and support to be strong. All of that is _so_ important to maintaining a healthy, healing mental outlook. I want to congratulate you on being kind to you.

The thing that I missed, early on, is that while _I_ was doing everything that I could to save the relationship my WGF, like your WH, had _already_ chosen another relationship over ours. From there, circumstances between you and I differ markedly.

And I acknowledge with gratitude the thanks that you directed at me in a prior post of yours. I encourage you to stay on here at SI as you move through the D process and then move over to New Beginnings, perhaps one day to start hanging around JFO again, offering succor to those who have JFO.

Have a great day!

EDITS were not meaning changing, just missed a word here and there. Prepositions and the like.

[This message edited by devotedman at 8:01 AM, October 15th, 2016 (Saturday)]

Me: 2xBS b 1962 xWW after 2 decades, xWGF after almost 1.
Amelia Pond: Who are you?
The Doctor: I don't know yet. I'm still cooking.
ENFP-A. Huh.

posts: 5155   ·   registered: Oct. 30th, 2014   ·   location: Central USA
id 7685442
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kimwik ( member #55025) posted at 2:02 PM on Saturday, October 15th, 2016

Too much drama. What do you want a divorce?, Reconciliation? Europe probably isn't the place to confront him, but , as a mature adult rather than playing cat and mouse, I think you need to tell him you saw a text, know he deleted it from your phone and know he has been having an affair. But, if you need more evidence or need to get things in order, then I would go home and cancel the vacation for both of you.

posts: 341   ·   registered: Sep. 6th, 2016
id 7685445
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 TurnOtherCheek (original poster member #55194) posted at 4:07 PM on Saturday, October 15th, 2016

The evenings are the hardest. This post is going to be long and sad but it's been a rough night. I've cried pretty much all night, barely slept and still can't sleep so thought it best to write it out here as this has really helped me this last month.

This spiral, otherwise known as my marriage and life, was so heavy last night. Alone. Friday night. Alone. This wasn't the life I had in mind for myself and not the one I signed up for when I decided to marry him. Aside from all the hurt he's caused me, his awful betrayal, I miss him. I hate him. But I miss him. I haven't spent more than 30 minutes with him this past month. I've spent only about an hour talking to him - all about his betrayal and disgusting behavior.

At my weakest moment tonight while tossing and turning in bed, I called him. It was after midnight but he answered. I want to try to remember the conversation because I know down the road it will be of some comfort to me or remind of the answers to so many of the questions constantly assaulting my mind. I don't journal. Maybe I should, but I don't, so I'll just write it here since I find myself coming back here to read the history of events otherwise known as the demise of my marriage plus I devour the responses and advice you all have given me. Such a gift.

I hope you don't mind that I write it out here and try to remember it the best I can this way.

Me: I'm so angry at you.

WH: I'm so sorry (breaks out crying.) I can't stand myself for what I've done and how I've hurt you.

Me: I'll never understand. I'll never get over it. (Now weepy, too.)

WH: I know.

Me: There's nothing more I could have done to make our marriage better. I don't know what was missing for you but I go over and over it in my mind and I can't think of a thing. I hate how I'm doubting myself and the feeling I get that our marriage was all a sham to you. If you needed something, you just needed to talk to me. Why didn't you just talk to me?

WH: I don't know but there isn't anything I thought was missing and I still don't think there is. I don't know what's wrong with me. I miss you so much. I feel like I'm dying.

Me: I guess then there was nothing missing but another woman for you. You're so selfish. What hurts the most is that you, more than anyone, knew how XH affair nearly destroyed me. I told you everything. You knew my weaknesses. You were the only one who could ever keep me safe from that again. I never expected that you of all people would stab me in the back. It's worse than XH because you knew how badly it would hurt me. You're supposed to have my back, not stab it. Now I know. No one can be trusted and definitely not you. Why'd you do it?

WH: (Crying) I've been asking myself over and over.

Me: And?

WH: The attention felt good.

Me: I'm guessing the sex did, too. It makes me sick thinking of you having sex with her. Physically sick. My skin crawls. I feel like I want to punch you, slap you, scratch your eyes out. It makes me even sicker that I feel this way. Fuck I hate you for that.

WH: I hate that I have done this to you. I'm so sorry.

Me: Are you still seeing her?

WH: No. Not at all. I told you I ended it when I did. I haven't spoken to her at all.

Me: You're lying. I know you are.

WH: I'm not lying. I haven't spoken to her.

Me: Oh, yes, of course I know you are being "literal" and not technically lying in your confused mind, because maybe you haven't spoken face to face or on the phone. Let me rephrase that - have you been in touch with her?

WH: No, not at all.

Me: I know you're lying and this is why we will never work this out.

WH: I have not been in touch with her.

Me: Since I know you're incapable of telling the truth, let me just save you this one time and tell you I know you have been in touch. I'm not stupid. Do you really think I would end our marriage over one text with absolutely no evidence of an affair? How heartless do you think I am? Do you really think I wouldn't have just assumed you meant that text for me and think, "oh how fun, he wants to be playful with me," if I didn't know somehow that there was something going on with someone else? How do you think I found that out? How did you stay in touch with your piece of ass throughout your whole sordid affair? Just think real hard for a minute on that because the last thing I am is stupid and I know you have been in touch! You're such a liar.

WH: By phone.

Me: You're a fucking genius.

WH: But I still haven't been in touch with her.

Me; Such a liar. Every call, every text leaves a trail.

WH: I haven't texted her or called her.

Me: Fucking calls and texts work both ways, genius.

WH: She texted me.

Me: See, your first inclination will always be to lie first, think about the truth later. (I knew she texted because I'm an idiot and checked phone records again.) I can't and won't live like this, always feeling the need to check up on things and you. You just proved you aren't trustworthy yet again.

WH: But I didn't reach out to her.

Me: The fact you don't know what "being in touch" means pisses me off. I thought you were smarter than that.

WH: I guess you sent her a message or text. She texted me and told me and wanted to know what I thought you were going to do.

Me: The fact she even thought you were the person she should ask that question of tells me she came to rely on you. That pisses me off even more. And the fact that right now I think you didn't tell me about the text was because you were protecting her? This enrages me even more!

WH: I'm not protecting her. I didn't text her back. (I know he didn't, at least not via mobile service.)

Me: You could totally be lying and I would never know because there are all kinds of ways to communicate now that leave no record that can be traced. I'm just gonna assume you're lying. What did she say in her texts to you?

WH: She wanted to know if she should be worried about you. If you were angry and planning to do anything. What she should say to you if anything.

Me: That's rich. She fucks my husband and then is worried that I'll exact any revenge. You picked a real winner there. I guess she thinks bad behavior should have no consequences? Her daughter has no hope of having a decent mother. Why didn't you comfort her, tell her it would be alright and you'd take care of everything? Isn't that the role you wanted in all of this?

WH: I can't even think about her without being angry at myself. I didn't want her to think she could still contact me and I would reply. I told her it was over. I mean that. It is over. Please know this.

Me: I just think you don't trust yourself. If you start talking to her again your dick might fall back in her.

WH: Being crude isn't your style.

Me: Fuck you. I didn't think fucking other women was your style and yet here we are. I guess neither of us is who we thought we were.

WH: I'm sorry. I have no attachment to her at all. I won't be seeing or reaching out to her again. Ever.

Me: Then you're a cruel son of a bitch for using her that way. She definitely felt some attachment for you if you're the first person she runs to when the big, bad betrayed wife sends a note, which was not at all threatening by the way, to her. She's weak. I didn't take you for someone who preyed on weak women.

WH: I didn't prey on her. I don't know how it happened. We just started talking about the dogs. She showed me how to teach them some tricks and it just grew from there. It was so stupid.

Me: "It" wasn't stupid. You were. You are. Jesus, how did I misjudge you so badly?

WH: It was all a mistake.

Me: A mistake happens once. How do you explain 6 months, if that is even the truth.

WH: It was 4 months, maybe less.

Me: Really? You want to argue the severity of your affair this way? 6 months if you add the "courting someone other than your wife" time. I bet you loved that time. How fun to be flirting with new love while I was obliviously in love with my wonderful husband.

WH: I didn't love her.

Me: Stop telling me that. In my mind and heart, you were head over heels in love and couldn't wait to spend every possible moment with her. It better have been something so powerful you just could not control yourself. Thinking it was just a "ho hum, might as well" feeling makes it even worse for me. If you could break my heart over a "gee, she's good enough" affair, then I can't even comprehend who you are. I am a fucking goddamn prize! You better have felt like you got struck by lightning when you saw her to have thrown me to the curb like you did.

WH: I wasn't thinking at all obviously. I just liked the attention. I don't even know why she liked me but she made it clear and was very friendly.

Me: And you just lack self-restraint? Is that what you're telling me? Being married just slipped your mind? The ring on your finger was invisible? Did you take it off to make yourself feel better?

WH: No, I never took my ring off. She of course knew I was married.

Me: I can't believe you let her in our house alone. What the fuck? Fuck, fuck, fuck. Do you have any idea what that does to me to even think about it? God damn you. How could you be so stupid? She cuddled with my dog!!! I'll never get over this. What an incredible violation. What the hell were you thinking while she was in our house alone?

WH: I was always panicked. It freaked me out but I just didn't know how to deal with telling her no. I was a mess. It was awful.

Me: What? Did she threaten you with telling me?

WH: No. But she acted hurt when we would go away and said this would help her feel less sad.

Me: Fucking genius you are.

WH: She always acted professional.

Me: Except when she was fucking my husband.

WH: I know her business is important to her.

Me: Not as important as you think obviously. My god you are such an idiot on a scale I can't even register.

WH: Is there any chance you'll keep talking to me and let us try to work it out? I'm so miserable without you at home.

Me: I'm so miserable knowing you could do this to me. I'm not the one who had to get married, remember? I told you I was perfectly fine to be exclusive companions and if it were that way to the end of our lives I could live with that. You convinced me otherwise. Why if that isn't what you really wanted?

WH: It is what I want. I made a horrible mistake. I'll never be able to forgive myself for picking my ego over you. That's all it was. It made me feel good for a few minute but it definitely wasn't worth it. It was not worth the pain I caused you or losing you.

Me: We had a deal. Cheating means it's over. Why shouldn't that apply to your cheating?

WH: It should. I just never imagined. I'm so sorry. Is there any hope? Am I not worth even considering trying?

Me: I saw myself growing old with you. I used to be bummed that I would never be the person who got to celebrate a Golden 50th Anniversary with the love of my life but I thought hey, we might get 30 years together and that would be awesome and cool, too. Just that thought alone brought me comfort. I am shaken to my core at how easy it was for you to just destroy that.

WH: (Crying) I'm so sorry. I've never loved anyone as much as you and I never, ever wanted to hurt you. I've just been such an idiot. We built a good life and it is all I need. I know that. Now.

Me: You know it's too late, right?

WH: Please don't say that. Please let me try to make it better.

Me: (Crying) I just don't have it in me. Life is short. It grows shorter every day for us. I'm not a bright-eyed 20 year old anymore looking at rainbows and bliss if we can get past all the hurt. I'm an aging 53 year old woman who knows time is precious and that spending years trying to fix something I didn't break is not the best use of the precious time I have left. I'm just not up for the hard road ahead. It was never part of my plan. Our plan.

WH: Just think about it, please.

Me: It's all I have been doing for a month now. What an enormous waste of precious time. It's been excruciating. I just don't have it in me. We need to start our own healing now and find a way to make the best of the rest of the time we have left.

WH: Please don't hang up. Please keep talking to me. Please.

Me. I don't mind telling you that aside from your very bad behavior and indiscretion, you were a very good husband. We really did build a nice life and I loved the life we had. You made it easy to love you. I hope I made it easy to love me. If you find that again, please treasure it. Don't taint it. Put it on a pedestal and honor it. I've learned it can be rare.

WH: Please don't go.

Me: I have to go now. Thank you for the part of the journey of my life we shared but it has come to its end. I saw it going much longer but it's come to its end. (Click.)

I'm an absolute mess so now I'm going to get up, shower and go to a yoga class. Go find some strength and maybe myself along the way.

Have a good day, everyone. Love with everything you have.

Me: BW x 2 - 53
Ist XWH: Married over 17 years, DD and DS (mine)
2nd XH: Also 53, DS (his), 8 yrs together
OW: Pet sitter
D-Day: 9/11/16
Divorced in 60 seconds flat. http://www.survivinginfidelity.com/forums.asp?tid=591733

posts: 441   ·   registered: Sep. 17th, 2016
id 7685495
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