SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Don't throw my marriage away and her son.

This pisses me off no end.

You're not throwing away the marriage she did, and the emotional blackmail not to throw away her son, that's just low.

She has to do a complete 180 in terms of not only changing her bad choices but also changing her entire character. At her age she's hard wired, do you honestly and I mean honestly, see her transforming herself almost phoenix like into a completely different woman who you'll feel safe with.

Will she do away with her selfish ways after the heat dies down and things return to normal?

Don't be a nice guy or KISA because you think you're the nicest guy out of the guys she's been with. Not your mission to save screwed up.

I have been following this thread for a while now, and kept my mouth shut because others were giving the best advice possible, but I can no longer keep my mouth shut.

Gary - Your job is NOT to be "Knight in Shining Armor" (KISA). Your job is NOT to allow her to disrespect and abuse you so that you can be a father to her son. Your job is NOT to be the sole breadwinner, so she can sit on her ass, and shop, and bitch about how hard her life is.

It's time to bring down the hammer. She is a manipulative, remorseless wayward, who cheated, and has not changed one iota yet.

You need to either decide to stay or leave, and if you choose to stay you need to be very clear and concise, as to what is going to happen moving forward.

1. She gets a job. NOW. I don't care if it's slinging hash at the local Waffle House. She has too much time on her hands, and has no respect for you or what you provide, because she has lost the ability to relate to how hard you are working for her.

2. She gets her ass in IC NOW. She needs to do some serious digging about why she needs all the this ego stroking and why she feels it's ok manipulate (a form a abuse) the people she supposedly loves, you and her parents are clearly in this group just based on what you have posted here.

3. YOU have to start calling her out on the manipulations. When she says stuff like you promised not leave - You have have to call BULLSHIT - and remind why you are contemplating it now. YOU have to make her own her choices. If you don't she won't.

This can be a very effective technique. But it takes both of you being very real and authentic.

4. Get yourself in IC. Learn why you need to be her hero. Learn why you think your happiness should be based on her and her son, as opposed to within yourself. When we rely on others for our happiness we become victims. When happiness and wholeness comes from within then we no longer allow this to happen.

But at the same token they asked me to work thru this with her.

Everyone has this completely backwards, they tell you to work on the marriage. NOPE, it is not up to you to work on the marriage in any way at this time.

It is completely up to your wife to work on the marriage. She is the one that has a great deal of work to do, that she continues to refuse to do.

Try and make everyone involved understand, that it is not up to you at this point.

Gary,

I to was very much a stick to the vows kinda of person. We have reconciled. It was not easy. It took 2 1/2 years for a remorseful but troubled fwh going to intense ic for this to happen. My husband was later diagnosised with asbergers.

I see you living in fear like I did about what it would mean for our child. The difference is you do not have legal rights.

For you to reconcile your going to need to address a few things.

1) Just who is the victim here? you or your wife?

I mentioned this to you before and the best way I could get to my then wallowing wh was to explain you stabbed me with every text, every touch and every bad word. I am bleeding to death and your saying just forget it and have sex with me. Would you say that if you literally saw me bleeding.

2) entitlement- your wife still feels entitled to everything. Your wife thinks its okay for you to do all the cooking and cleaning while she sits on the phone and cackles all day long. For me I didn't call my fwh out on his issues because I loved him, d day I no longer could excuse his behavior. I saw I was just enabling his poor behavior.

3) blameshifting- your wife cites her affair was due to your lack of attention. She doesn't see you were working your fanny off for her to sit on her throne. She just sees you weren't there to grovel at her feet.

4) Your wife has narcisstic tendancies it is all about her. It is still all about her, don't make me look bad to my family. Just say we are fighting.

I am really sorry to say this, did it ever occur to you that your wife wasn't honest about how bad that her past men treated her. Maybe they didnh't want to put up with dealing with a princess and her demands and told her no.

As for the father of her child, there is no excuse for him not supporting his child.

I also enjoyed my fwh, I excused a lot of his nonsense because of it. I culminated in his brokenness resulting in him cheating.

My fear for you is this, unless she can really understand and take responsibility for what she had done and see all the damage it will happen again.

My other fear for you is you see like a low key guy who seems to want to recover at all costs.

I honestly had to tell my fwh I would divicore him if he did not do a list of things. In my opinion your still being to soft on your wife. She is acting like a child and it seems no one has ever held her accountable.

1) have her write a timeline

2) have her start ic

3) have her start a job so your not working to

4) lay it out about her lazy ways of sleeping in while your taking care of your child and working two jobs

5) explain to her when she was faithful you put up with a lot now not so much

6) find a good therapist for mc

I'm curious, why did they think YOU were cheating? Would a wife who was truly remorseful, who really had your best interests at heart let her family believe that? Worse yet, did she tell them that?

Brother, she's perfectly willing and capable of throwing you under the bus if it fulfills her needs and desires. Worse yet, she did it to her son also.

She is not remorseful. Far from it. She is still exhibiting a wayward mindset.

Strength

Marc, Craig, Tren and Tushnurse are right, Gary.

Melodie Beattie's Codependennt No More. It's on Amazon. I know I keep saying this Gary but your inability to get out of limbo and your defenses of her and everything you did to support her leading up to her affair IMO shows some signs of codependency. This is not an attack on you, it's my opinion. I know some people who were on the fence for a long time and kept getting drawn back into a horrible situation but read this book and it helped them move forward.

Just a suggestion.

Sorry for the late response back to some of what was asked. Thank you to all that did. It was very sobering and powerful to read at the same time.

My inlaws thought I cheated cause when my step son said we were fighting he also told them I was sleeping in the other room by myself. And with me leaving for the weekend they assumed it was me that was told to leave and kicked out of my bedroom.

Yes I am a low key guy and that is what is probably causing me not to act the way I should. I think the one point I do agree with and will want to hold firm is her working. I know she has the offer for the part time karate studio and its not much but I think it would be good for her. The other stuff she is right when she told me it didn't bother me before. I don't care I didn't ask for a maid, I don't think that is a wifes role. But I want to be appreciated for it though.

Maybe I am co dependent. I don't think I am, I have lived on my own and stuff before. But that was awhile ago and I would hate to lose her son. And I am not 25 anymore not sure how much of a catch a 40 something guy is these days.

I think of leaving more and more. I don't want to feel this pain in my gut anymore. I just hate thinking my marriage is done. I know I know I did a lot for my wife but in some way she did cheat. I cant help but think could have I don't more or something different? I prided myself on wanting to be a good husband someone my wife could look at and be thankful for. This has given me a shot of low self esteem.

Here is the thing I listen to the VARs everynight. I hear my wife talk to the social group. I do hear her say she is afraid I am leaving. She messed up and is sorry, I hear those things too. But I don't sense that we will ever be connected like we were before all this. I cant help feeling taken for a ride.

Her parents want us to talk to someone in their church. Now I want to say I was not really raised with religion. I respect people that are involved in what they believe and practice. But I don't want to talk to someone in there. I feel its more for her parents anyway. My wife only brings up her religion when is suits her. Only time I ever have had tough time with her mother was when I said I would allow whatever they do in religion but would not convert like they wanted me to.

So I am very uninformed with the Jewish faith would meeting with someone there be a good or bad thing for me or us?

Like anything else there are good and bad religious leaders. Probably what you'll get is save the marriage at all cost.

I don't have s lot of faith in these folk. I've been around many.

You need to think about long term. Can you live with this? Is she what you want to spend the rest of your life with?

Maybe I am co dependent. I don't think I am, I have lived on my own and stuff before.

You are kidding right? Seriously, your being concerned about being alone, that comes out in the same breath as not being CoD..... Um maybe you need to educate yourself a bit more on what CoD is, and what people that are do, and how they live for happiness through others.

And I am not 25 anymore not sure how much of a catch a 40 something guy is these days.

I think of leaving more and more.

GOOD!!!

I don't want to feel this pain in my gut anymore.

None of do/did, but we were not given a choice, it is the hand that was dealt, and deal we will.

she did cheat.

YUP She sure did, not in "some way, but she really cheated, and is remorseless.

I cant help but think could have I don't more or something different? I prided myself on wanting to be a good husband someone my wife could look at and be thankful for

.

Again, basing your happiness off of her beliefs, and attitudes. What about being proud of the man you are, and not worrying about what your blameshifting, remorseless wife thinks?

This has given me a shot of low self esteem.

Yup pretty much rocks your world, when the person you believe hung the moon and stars, shows you that you are of no value other than a paycheck and a babysitter, and maid to them.

It's time to value YOU Gary. NOT her. YOU.

Her parents want you to see a Rabbi, great, tell them you will be happy to, as soon as she confesses what she has done to them and you, and explains in some way why she did and expressed some form of understanding for the pain she is causing.

MR.Gary,

Western is on par here. You seem to be having a hard time taking the reigns of this thing, and your proposed lack of focus is a warning sign. Co-dependency is a drug, an emotional stimulant we use to replace the feelings of loss and love. It is a method of stimulating certain chemicals in our mind. It is the killer of real love.

I've asked if your willing to kick this situation in the butt and take control so you can salvage what you want and leave what you don't want. That takes a interdependent person. You have to ask why her actions affect you doing what you have to do? I am not saying the don't affect you because they will but they shouldn't define you or what you have to do to protect yourself, her, her son, and your family.

Your past is similar to mine. Except at the end my mother ran off leaving me and my brother (a minor) for 9 years with NC....then my father left never saw him again.

I fought my way off the streets of East Oakland in the 90's. MY accomplishments and my money began to define me. I thought that is what life was about. How much I was able to fulfill my place in others around me. My brother was going to be cared for. I was never going to be poor again. I I I . Women loved it, at least shallow women did. I was a jerk, kept minimal relationships, and never felt fulfilled. Kept things shallow with people and was really stuck, but didn't know it then. I liked it. People depend on me. I was my own, I was me.

It changed me. Made me feel like I was supposed to do everything or I would lose everything. and it left me feeling Guilty when I couldn't. Imagine how I felt when I had to spend 9 years in a wheelchair and losing my place as the 6 figure bread winner. I hadn't come the to conclusion that I couldn't save my mom. No matter what happens, it wasn't my fault, but i thought it was. "In Really that was my own selfishness, not love" and I projected that onto my wife.

That all changed with my wife. I fell head over heels for her. She was smart, pretty, and all giving. She didn't ask for anything. She was from a rich family so her attitude was the opposite of those around me. That changed when we got married. I grew selfish and she withdrew. I didn't understand the time it was my own insecurities that got in the way...

When terrible things started to happen in my relationship with my wife... I blamed myself. This just made my situation worse. I was having my own pity party.. woe is me.. woe is me. She is doing this, she isn't doing that (she did some terrible things), but I didn't want to step up to the plate. In reality I was fear/ guilt driven. I was scared of failure, and scared to lose her. This helped nothing in my relationship with my wife, nor my own self esteem pride etc...

When I took a deep look at myself and what I wanted. What was healthy and why I couldn't see healthy, the blinders came off. I had to admit what my issues were. I had to admit, my own belittled self esteem. That I was my own enemy in certain areas of my life. Regardless of what my wife was doing, I was me. I will not, could not, would not change unless I took the responsibility to not hide from my own problems. After this change occurred (and hearing God in my life), I realized something that changed my life.....

How could i expect people around me to change, when I wasn't willing to stand up and lead the way. If I was wallowing in Bull DUNG, how could I expect others not to wrinkle their noses when they were dealing with me? These were false expectations on my part. IN that moment I grew up past my mother and my father.. I became a man. My realization that society doesn't define me, relationships don't define me, and hell media doesn't define me. My wife told me my expressions changed, and all of a sudden she realized if she didn't change what she would lose me.

I didn't take it. I left the master bedroom to become a pig style then moved into the living room. Washed my own dishes. I told her to quit or keep her EAs, that it didn't matter anymore. She didn't define me, our relationship didn't define me. I defined me :). Became ready to move on with my life. Oh I told her that i love her, but would NO LONGER put up with her crap. Oh I loved her. I was there. I listened. I helped in areas I knew I needed to. The difference was I no longer TOOK IT. If I didn't like it. I told I didn't like something, why I didn't, agreed to disagree and disconnected from that problem. I didn't throw her away. I just wouldn't participate in her crap. Example. She wanted to do something I couldn't participate in because of my health. When she pushed for it, it made me feel terrible that I couldn't participate. She said other couples were doing this etc. I told her it makes me feel terrible, and that if she continued to do so, I would cut off her conversation, reminding her that it was disrespectful and I was no longer putting myself in this position. Most of the time she got it.. sometimes she didn't. Either way she began to change.. She started to learn what my boundaries were, and she became more loving in her leaning. I started to learn her boundaries and helped myself to learn how to deal with those in positive ways.

She was shocked. At first she didn't like the changes and became vicious. Then suddenly one day it stopped. My wife came up to me and said she was sorry and thanked me for being a rock. That was 10 years ago. It doesn't always happen this way. I was blessed. I will tell you though my actions helped precipitate the change, but she had to make the decision. I was just extra patient, BECAUSE I DECIDED WHAT I WANTED. Which was a lifetime of healthy love with her. :)

It hasn't been all roses and cupcakes. There is more to the story. I abused the power-shift later justifying my actions with her actions ( lol forgot that she doesn't define me) and made some horrible choices. Now I am rebuilding our lives and her self-esteem as well. She is returning the favor of growing in her own maturity past me and encouraging me to come along lol.

Now. Praise God, I am out of a wheelchair. I ride a crotch rocket at 40's cause I want to . I am going to college cause I want to. I am learning to affirm my wife and love on her everyday, not cause I have to, or I am scared about losing her, but cause I want to I lost 70 pounds 230 to 160 cause I want to. My wife says I look sexy now, with all my muscles LOL. I told I did it because it made me feel good, I am glad she likes it though. She says that's sexy...

I mentor and help people on the streets, cause I like to I work as a chaplain, cause it gives me the opportunity to help others around me. I write here, learning to listen and clarify my thoughts because I hope I can be of service to others around me. Not because it fulfills me, but because I love to.

Might want to tell your freind that you need to put his deck on hold, and take care of your needs.

Maybe IC at this point could help your put things in to perspective? And religious counselors if they are good can help too.. just look past the religious part. All in all you will find they have mostly the save value and moral set that you do, and if they don't, well.. YOU GOT IT, PASS! they don't define you.

Shrug. I hope this helps a little. If you would like some advice on this path let me know....

[This message edited by ToastedOats at 2:10 PM, April 25th (Monday)]

I am glad MARC, Tushnurse amd Toastedoats are helping you out like they are. Please read Toastedoats story. I respect his sharing his story and trying to help you by using it. See how much he overcame. That is a credit to him.

Gary, I am trying to get you out of limbo. That is your first step to success. Don't kick yourself for being 'too nice'. If my wife let me retire early tomorrow and took a second job, I would be Mr. Clean at home and would pick up the slack elsewhere. The fact that you took the second job and raised her kid as well, she should be sitting at home daydreaming of you rather than doing what she did.

get out of limbo Gary

I agree with Tushnurse completely

[This message edited by Western at 2:18 PM, April 25th (Monday)]

Western. I love your quote. What does a monkey do? Whatever it sees, regardless of the consequences. LOL.

do I really want to start over guy in his 40's no family or kids off a divorce?

Hell yeah. Yes you do. Guys peak at age 35. You're still almost at your peak.

Go work out. Get some new clothes. Women will be all over you. That should be the least of your problems. You will upgrade, your wife will downgrade. I guarantee it.

Toastedoats said

My realization that society doesn't define me, relationships don't define me, and hell media doesn't define me. My wife told me my expressions changed, and all of a sudden she realized if she didn't change what she would lose me.

There you go. Your validation doesn't come from your wife.

You need to be strong, be a rock, like Toastedoats. Your wife won't respect you unless you're strong.

thanks ToastedOats

[This message edited by Western at 3:34 PM, April 25th (Monday)]

ToasteOats, man I am so humbled reading your story. What a guy you are man be proud. I shoudnt even complain after reading that. I am thankful you took the time to respond to me. I will take your advice to heart trust me. Its the least I can do.

Western trust me man I don't want to be in limbo either. I wish my mind and heart would allow me to just say ok that is it and lets go. I am a logical man if I knew I could just go one way and be done with it I wouldn't be wasting your all time on here.

I look in the mirror everyday and don't like what I see believe me. How I am treated, how my marriage is in shambles, how my step son is upset and sees what is going on. I don't like myself either. The whole thing sucks.

I have asked what you all have asked me. What is it that keeps you. I don't know. Part of it is her son. Part of it is I know how she was and can be. Maybe I need to let that go.

"I have asked what you all have asked me. What is it that keeps you. I don't know. Part of it is her son. Part of it is I know how she was and can be. Maybe I need to let that go."

Takes a deep breath. /me responds in a quiet voice:

That is co-dependency. When you look to something on outside to fill the inside. When things are great you feel euphoric, when they are not there you feel scared drained, fear, guilt, even when you shouldn't. You know she can never be perfect, and now she is not the pure woman you thought she was...no you are not as full.

Things on the outside should compliment you in the inside not be what fill you up.

On the inside of me? :)

Happiness. My relationship with GOD, the excitement of what tomorrow brings. Bad or good doesn't matter. Inner contentment with who I am maturing into. Someone who no longer looks for affirmation on the outside, but accepts it when it come. Then my relations with my wife and my son is complimentary. Regardless of what happens

Btw. If your the only father he has ever known. He will always look to you as a father. Be someone who holds your self as such regardless of the relationship with your wife.. I would think that saying "her son" isn't quite right? But my son might be more appropriate?

Look deep. Perhaps you are in love with who you thought she was not who she really is. Hence, the phrase " love is blind"

You have to determine that. You're young. You have a full life ahead of you. Can she be what you need? The signs so far don't look good.

It will manifest itself no matter what. The word broken-hearted is called that for a reason. You're going through it now.

You have much thinking to do on this. Do not rush it. Words from her don't mean much as you've found. Her actions are what count. No one should be calling the shots on this but you.

No one elses opinions count. But you've gotten enough to know where you are and what you need to do to get this figured out.

Good luck

Reread your thread. Pretend it's a friend asking your opinion on what to do.

What would you tell him?

The way she cheated by having sex with the AP in your marital bed is the ultimate dissrespect that a WS can deliver to their M and is something you cannot ignore or will ever forget.

She is not remorseful, she has realized there was no future with her FB and she can be out on her ass unless she pulls some strings to keep you hanging on. You do realize that the A would still be ongoing if you had not found the Viagra beside your bed nightstand, that in itself should clairify your way forward.

Good luck my man