SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Heading home in a few. Looks like she is still there. Wish me luck.

Hey Dan,

I know reading all the input here must feel a bit like trying to drink from a fire hose. Everyone wants to help. And there are some real pearls in the past 40+ pages but boy is it a lot for someone 4 days out from d-day.

How are you feeling?

Dan,

I’m sorry for what you are going through. I am noticing a pattern in a lot of the responses. Your experience is triggering a lot of people here and they are understandably projecting their experiences onto yours. I’m hearing some wild tales of what she must have been up to when she went shopping or how she is still trying to meet with the douche. For many of us, even honesty looks like lies because we were deceived for so long. Many of us experienced substantial trickle truth and blame shifting for months before “the truth” came out.

Since you caught your wife she has tried to do everything in her power to do what she can to fix this. She quit her job. Almost no wayward does that who isn’t all in on trying to reconcile. Some might say that she did that because she was humiliated by the fight. But that doesn’t track. Office Christmas parties are notorious for drama.

There still is some question about the panties, groped over or under, and on or off. Get clarification, but know she was running on an irrational high. None of it will make any sense now. She wasn’t thinking things through. She was caught up and stupid. I think it’s very possible that the relief she felt when she found out you were coming to the party was real. She was out of control and knew it. Then it all crashed hard. Get a polygraph and a drug test. Those are just consequences of her deceit. Take as much time as you need to decide, and watch how she behaves.

Yesterday she should have kept the phone on her, but it’s not realistic that she would know how important that was yet. She hasn’t been in this site and doesn’t have hundreds offering her advice to know how she should fix this.

You have every reason not to trust her, but ask yourself this. If she was being honest. What more could she do?

You are handling this well. (Edited for typo)

[This message edited by Washashore at 3:46 PM, December 18th (Tuesday)]

Hey Dan,

I know reading all the input here must feel a bit like trying to drink from a fire hose. Everyone wants to help. And there are some real pearls in the past 40+ pages but boy is it a lot for someone 4 days out from d-day.

How are you feeling?

Feeling a little better today. Thank you all for the support. Its nice to know that there are people out there who understand and want to help. SI is like having a personal life coach to guide me out of this shit storm.

Hi Dan,

I know this has all been tough, but if it end up just being some teenage feel up over the clothing from Pepe Le Teenie Tiny Weenie, and your wife comes away from all this with the Fear of God of an Affair for the rest of her life, it seems like an R might be a good idea. She seems remorseful and seems to be putting in the effort. Make sure you get 100% truthfulness and all the info you need. However, it seems to me like you could move forward with this one.

Just my $0.02.

Dan,

Do you have a plan for tonight? A plan gives you a sense of control.

Will you guys meet again tonight? What topics do you want to cover?

I keep stressing 'control' because it seems to help a little when your life is blown up and you're eating a shit sandwich every day.

Try to control the topics discussed to satisfy your need to know. If she goes off topic, interrupt and tell her it's not relevant to your decision to D or R. It's not about being polite or smooth it's about retaining control.

Either you pick the time tonight ... or better if she suggests a time - you change it to 'your' time. For example, if she says 9:00, you tell her 9:30 is convenient for you.

[This message edited by Robert22205https at 7:43 PM, December 18th (Tuesday)]

Dan,

Its Been a long time since last time I posted.

IMO regardin Kelly is a Matter if 2 quetions:

Did she know about OM before you?

If yes. Did she enable un any form the affair?

As this moment, Kelly could be handling her phone to OM while talking to your wife. She also seems to be your wife friend, so I wonde if she used to have lunch with your wife and was OK with your wife going with OM without her.

I am sorry but is very unlikely that this was your wifes first affair. She was 100% into OM within days , she was really looking for It. The way It scalated in a couple of days wiht very limited contact is not forma someone that was not looking for It.

The contacto with all the people that knew before you and enable the affair must be severed.

Another explanation is that the affair strted earlier

There is alot your wife needs to explain.

Good luck

Dan,

I second the statement that many here are speculating through their own pain and projecting their own experiences on yours. Don't let them feed your paranoia. My fWW dumped her AP as soon as it all came to light, and never looked back. It sounds like that is what your WW wants too. (why did she leave the phone to go shop? Because it was your niece's phone, and she was only using it.)

I agree with others, get to the bottom of this, do the poly, find out what you need, but beware that too much info or too little can create mind movies that you will have a hard time shaking. Get only what you need.

Don't feed the voyeurs in this thread that keep suggesting or asking for salacious details. It's pretty sick. It is enough to say you should be prepared for stuff that will hurt. You should be prepared for her to be to embarrassed to give tough details. And for God's sake, don't share everything here, it is not necessary for people to help you.

Last, don't buy into the "burn the witch" crowd's bs that a man is not a man if they don't dump the bitch. If you decide to R, you are not weak. If you decide to D, you are not weak. If you decide either because you are afraid someone will call you weak or look down on you...you are weak. You decide for yourself.

Why do they do this? I once told my fWW that weak broken men can get laid easy, if they look for a weakness in a woman. Low self-esteem, low self-confidence, whatever, then they chat them up and make them feel like a queen. That is likely what this AP did. Yep, she bit, and nobody gets a pass for that. But it did not have to do with you.

I wish you well brother. Beware the trolls on this forum. You will know who they are by their need to project their pain into your situation or call your WW all kinds of names that you would (without this situation) knock them on their ass for saying.

Like someone else said, this is a marathon not a sprint. Pace yourself.

I may have missed this information in the 40+ prior pages. Your WW spent lots of time with her sister this weekend and people here are noting actions taken by your WW after getting in touch with SIL that give the appearance that she's starting to realize the situation she created. What do you know about how her sister is reacting to this? Do you know if she's been telling your WW how much she f'ed up? Or is she into lip-service and rugsweeping?

An IC would need to first learn a lot about your WW over many sessions, learn about the situation from her POV, and make judgments based on what WW says. Her sister, living locally, probably knows your WW very well, including things siblings tend to know about each other, possibly bypassing the issues some here have had with an IC being "snowed" by their WS and the WS presenting themselves as a good person and it was a misunderstanding, or something like that. SIL might be cutting through that stage and is able to tell WW where her head is located. Is her sister older than her or younger than her?

Is your SIL in the mental health field or does she tend to be that type of person in the family that is level-headed that puts others straight when they ask her for advice? Does SIL or BIL have relatives on that side of the family or friends who've been impacted by infidelity? Maybe that is playing a part in how you see your WW acting now.

Wishing you the best on your journey.

Dan, you've been thru a lot in a short period of time and seem to be taking it all in well.

From reading thru your comments, it seems to me that you have a salvageable situation with your Wife is you so choose.

Most people on this site, don't get to catch their WWs preStroke so to speak, but you did. You seem to have successfully snapped her out of it by being decisive and in control.

You WW gets not pass for the bullcrap that she tried to pull, but I think if you want, have a situation that is a lot better than most on here. Take a break from SI, clear your mind and continue to monitor the Wife through the holidays. Remember she gets not pass, but make sure to keep your daughters in mind too as the holidays are here. No need to drag them down b/c your WW was stupid. Get through the holidays and continue to monitor, take the poly and assess your situation.

Lastly, please have your wife report the behavior of that predator to the former company. Since she's not longer there, she should have no qualms about making the report as a condition for R. That predatory should be known to the company so that they can monitor his behavior.

Good luck

Please get your girls in therapy. You sound like a wonderful father. My mother cheated on my father when my sister and I were teens and we found out basically as my dad found out. We pretended to be unaffected and strong because we were so sad for our dad and angry with our mom. My sister eventually felt sorry for my mom. My parents did reconcile and they have been married nearly 40 years. BUT – my sister and I truly needed some therapy that we did not get and we both have had issues from that as adults. Don’t skip over the counseling. Have them go every week or every 2 weeks whether they think they need it or not. They do need it. The fact that they are trying to be strong for you is so sweet and shows what a great dad you are. I am sorry for all you and your girls are going through. They are lucky to have you. Even if they do start to feel sympathy for their mother they are always going to remember that she did this to you and that you are not the one that put everyone in this bad spot. Don’t worry about Team Mom or Team Dad. You are the only parent behaving like an adult. Let the girls feel and say whatever they want to. Their world is blown up, too. I am rooting for you, reconcile or divorce, I hope things work out well for you and that things calm down.

Don't feed the voyeurs in this thread that keep suggesting or asking for salacious details. It's pretty sick. It is enough to say you should be prepared for stuff that will hurt. You should be prepared for her to be to embarrassed to give tough details. And for God's sake, don't share everything here, it is not necessary for people to help you.

This! ^^^^ The details will likely matter to you personally, because you’ll want to really know if she’s telling the truth, and cross checking those details and how far it actually went will help you discern if you’re getting the whole truth or not. But as long as you know the difference between a steadfast, undebatable answer and a wishy washy one, you don’t need everyone else’s input on the specifics.

And in regards to the below:

Finally,(and I admit that this is my trigger issues surfacing) tell her that you'll only speak with her tonight if she dresses up and she's not wearing panties. And make her prove it.

Require her to look as good for you as she did the the OM. If you're not worth dressing up for then it's over. Taking back (1,000X over) what she gave the POS worked for me.

Please don’t play tit for tat. I understand feeling like she didn’t prioritize you or that you’re not important enough to dress up for, and those concerns can be addressed with her and with your IC, but whether deliberate or not, use of the phrase “taking back” suggests ownership over her, and that’s not what a healthy relationship should ever be based on.

There are already plenty of boundaries that Dan needs to set and enforce for him to even begin feeling comfortable with his spouse again, demanding that she put on the dress, not wear underwear, and then check? This crosses into some dominant/submissive territory that can’t possibly be healthy in terms of trying to wrap your head around her infidelity.

Just my two cents

Dan, switching gears here.

You've been married to your wife for a good number of years and have two daughters. How was your marriage up until the past two weeks?

Would you say your marriage/relationship was strong or have the two of you been slowly drifting apart?

Would you and your wife do things together (have date nights etc) or were you more like roommates?

Are you two affectionate with one another?

Has your wife made you a priority or is it all about the kids (and work)? And how about you towards her?

Trying to get a feel for how things have been between the two of you.

Has your wife done anything else over the past few years where you questioned her judgment?

Please don’t play tit for tat. I understand feeling like she didn’t prioritize you or that you’re not important enough to dress up for, and those concerns can be addressed with her and with your IC, but whether deliberate or not, use of the phrase “taking back” suggests ownership over her, and that’s not what a healthy relationship should ever be based on.

Yes, heaven forbid a WW put as much effort into her relationship with her BH as she did her AP.

HellFire, the phone is a catch-22. She doesn’t know she’s supposed to keep her niece’s phone with her at all time. If he tells her that, it’s no longer a secret.

Keeping her new phone (when she gets it) with her at all time can be (should be) part of his requirement list.

Woundedbear and Hehadadoublelife, BRAVO.

Many of the suggestions here in my opinion read like they would only introduce another layer of dysfunction, more wounds you’ll have to heal as a couple if you decide to reconcile, and even more permanent scars you’ll have to acknowledge and live with if you decide either divorce or reconciliation. It’s like deciding your burden isn’t already heavy enough so people are suggesting you strap a few boulders on to make the climb more exciting.

I know you’ve had to read hundreds of posts with advice, etc., but as I alluded to many pages back, you have to be able to like who you are when this is over, which means examining your motivations for what you ask of her. No one in your family right now lives in a vacuum with noise canceling headphones. How you handle this will be remembered and processed by your wife, kids, and extended family.

I’m making it sound like having self control and not getting angry is easy. It isn’t. That’s one of the things about negotiating this kind of suck in a marriage and why it is so horrible that we have support groups and online forums and counseling and other hopefully helpful places to turn.

Just my 2 cents.

Please don’t play tit for tat. I understand feeling like she didn’t prioritize you or that you’re not important enough to dress up for, and those concerns can be addressed with her and with your IC, but whether deliberate or not, use of the phrase “taking back” suggests ownership over her, and that’s not what a healthy relationship should ever be based on.

Oh please. A marriage or even a relationship is a mutual exchange of exclusivity, commitment, effort and much more.

A partner doesn't "own" the other partner but they "own" all the things freely given to one another, they "own" the marriage or relationship. If one wants to revoke this, they can at any point be upright and honest and tell their partner this.

What a betrayed partner is taking back isn't the cheater. Many aren't even interested in that, it's often times the cheater who seeks to reconcile.

They're taking back agency, their role in the relationship, their own self worth, the effort, attention, love and commitment that should've been put into the relationship all along.

Because there's a great many cases here and everywhere else. Where the cheater is willing to go to absurd lenghts, compromise rules they've uphold, break their own boundaries and go above and beyond to please their AP. Even while stonewalling their commited long term partner prior at every turn.

Praying that you have discernment tonight.

Please remember to post within guidelines. Be respectful to both DaninOH and his wife. There is no need to make vulgar comments about her. Remember that this is his wife and he is in pain. Give DaninOH the support he needs right now.

They're taking back agency, their role in the relationship, their own self worth, the effort, attention, love and commitment that should've been put into the relationship all along.

Marauder, agreed on all fronts. A BS has every right to the above. I took issue with the reference to “taking back” in that post as it specifically referred to forcing his wife to wear the dress, without underwear, and then checking to make sure, which suggests taking back her physical body in a way, or at least her agency over it.

We all know what the WW did was messed up on every level. But there is no need to retaliate in that way. There is already plenty to ask of her to prove her commitment to bettering herself, and then hopefully the marriage. Is verifying that she comes over without underwear on really going to make him feel better?

We all know that waywards often feel a lack in themselves that they are trying to fill. Will not wearing underwear for her husband somehow increase her self worth or fill that hole? Will it make her a more committed or loving partner? Will it make her a safe partner? No, because it is belittling and embarrassing. Revenge is not the answer