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I think that question could be flipped and generate just as many responses... ARE ASSHOLES ATTRACTED TO DECENT HUMANS?

The short answer to this is yes, assholes are attracted to decent humans.

They considered them easy. They got something from them that cost them much more than it was worth.

Thank you! Every boy I have ever had in my orbit of friends (cousins, little brothers, both blood related and spiritual, all of my boys when I was an RA in college, etc), the ONE piece of advice I give EVERY single one of them is: Don't stick your dick in crazy. Nothing good can come of it.

Unfortunately for buys though, it's mho that girls are better at hiding their crazy...

it's mho that girls are better at hiding their crazy...

I hope I won't be considered sexist for agreeing withy this. But, I realize it's a generalization and doesn't apply to all women.

This is a fair question. I think some men are.

There's your answer, then. While the movies may have conditioned us for what the generalities are that turn our heads, people are attracted to different things.

So, no, you don't have to be an asshole to get and keep a good woman. Any woman who says otherwise needs to dig a little deeper into why she thinks that.

Before dday and during the affair I guess he thought I was being a bitch to him this great guy. Idk I probably bought into that. Then after the second dday it became clear that I was the great person and he was the asshole. How the tables have turned. As it turns out I don't prefer assholes!

Are women attracted to assholes? Yes and no. My experience includes a period of several years of being a true cad, and having a lot of sex with a lot of women. It is my observation that a woman who is looking for casual sex will often opt for a guy who isnt a person she might develop real feelings for. It is, I think, a cousin of the Madonna/whore complex.

Your WW's AP takes it to another level. He was human scum, and I think your WW knew that during her A. Which leads me to believe that she was either consumed with self loathing, or she was specifically trying to hurt you.

I think you should ask her this question. What does she say? Even if she were single, the AP was a singularly bad person. Why would she choose to have a relationship with him under any circumstances, never mind as a married woman.

So, no, you don't have to be an asshole to get and keep a good woman. Any woman who says otherwise needs to dig a little deeper into why she thinks that.

I don't think assholes get to keep a good woman. A woman in a relationship with an asshole often comes to her senses and gets out of the relationship (My opinion only).

But, I think the asshole somehow has an ability to attract decent women, pulling them away from an existing positive relationship, at least temporarily, and then using them for as long as possible.

I think you should ask her this question. What does she say? Even if she were single, the AP was a singularly bad person. Why would she choose to have a relationship with him under any circumstances, never mind as a married woman.

I have asked her about this but never received an intelligible response.

For fear of generalizing, I think most women (and men for that matter) are attracted to confidence and self-esteem. As someone earlier in the thread said, sometimes this can “look like” an asshole.

Based on my personal experience: I have dated and been in relationships with mostly “nice guys.” Not the doormat “nice guys finish last” stereotype, but truly decent, respectful, respectable men. I have been lucky in that I’ve only encountered two actual creeps. In my personal experience with the nice decent ones, there is a distinction between the ones who were nice with healthy self-confidence and self-esteem and those without.

The ones without are, as I said, nice, decent, respectful, respectable, etc. but there is something “off” about them. They tend to have a neediness, a fear of rejection, an overmuch concern of my opinion of them, that is off-putting. They put out the vibe that they are nothing special, that they are not worth much, that they aren’t “good enough” with the ladies, that they’re lucky somehow to be with me....but that I’m not lucky to be with them in return. It’s eventually not attractive. The “Aw shucks” routine gets old after awhile and stops being endearing.

What I find attractive is the type who knows he’s a catch but is humble about it, still kind and decent but doesn’t need constant convincing of his worth as a partner. Who believes he’s attractive (or at least believes *I* think he is) and doesn’t act like he’s trying to convince me that I could do so much better. I think that’s how a lot of the pedestal-putters come off.

[This message edited by Darkness Falls at 12:25 PM, November 14th (Thursday)]

As I look back on my wife's affair with the POSOM, I still find it impossible to believe that a.) any woman would be attracted to him and b.) my wife would choose to allow this walking cesspool to stick his dick into her.

He was living with at least one other woman at the time. He was literally sleeping with every woman in their office. He was having sex with the wives of some of the men for whom he was providing caretaking...

In my mind I picture it this way:

There are 30-40 women standing in a room with him while he waits to be serviced by each one. For some reason each woman is hoping he calls her name, as soon as he stops fucking the one before her in line.

It's absolutely disgusting. If I had slept with any other woman while we were dating or married, she would've been gone in a heartbeat. Yet, she chose to play the female version of sloppy seconds (and thirds, and fourths, ad infinitum). It's gross, disgusting and potentially dangerous.

I am so disgusted by it I still can't bring myself to have sex with her now. I can't bring myself to boldly go where a POSOM has gone before.

I think a lot of people find themselves attracted to or thinking about somebody who is drastically different than they are. I know I have. I think there's something about a bad girl or a bad boy that seems very very surface level attractive. I don't think that's unhealthy by itself. If you're attracted to people who treat you and others badly, more than the acting all cool and aloof, then yes, that's definitely unhealthy. As another posted said, unhealthy people seem to be attracted to unhealthy people because it feeds their behavior in some way. It's like drug addicts hanging out with other drug addicts.

In general, I don't think most people want to be with a scumbag or asshole.

36 - I'm not going to focus on the part of the question that is about comparing you with your WW's AP. Because there clearly isn't even a comparison. You are better than him without trying.

But I do want to say something about pedestals. The problem is that the one on the pedestal knows that it comes with a set of expectations. No-one expects perfection, but there can be a subtle pressure to aspire to it ... to earn it. It is incredibly liberating to be in a relationship with someone who treats you the same, independent of how successful you are at being a "good girl".

I fell in love with someone who encouraged me to be better, but I stayed in love (and in lust) with him because he didn't see me differently when I showed him the mud on my feet (or shared my more peculiar sexual fantasies or rather dark sense of humor with him).

No, I don't think that women prefer assholes, who presumably have low/no expectations. But knowing that you don't have to be on your best behavior with someone (to earn their adoration) can be very seductive. I'd rather be accepted for who I am, then treasured for who I'm trying to be.

But I do want to say something about pedestals. The problem is that the one on the pedestal knows that it comes with a set of expectations. No-one expects perfection, but there can be a subtle pressure to aspire to it ... to earn it. It is incredibly liberating to be in a relationship with someone who treats you the same, independent of how successful you are at being a "good girl".

I have probably been unclear. I never placed my wife on a pedestal because she earned it, had to earn it, deserved it because of her character or behavior or anything else. I placed her on a pedestal because she was my wife. I poured all my effort, hard work and treasure into her whether she deserved it or not. I felt then, and still believe now, that a man should treat his wife as the most important person in the world.

Part of putting her on a pedestal was treating her as an equal in every way. I feel that she began to feel guilty and undeserving of be treated so well because she was, in essence, treating our relationship as something only worthy of being thrown away.

I poured all my effort, hard work and treasure into her whether she deserved it or not. I felt then, and still believe now, that a man should treat his wife as the most important person in the world.

Part of putting her on a pedestal was treating her as an equal in every way. I feel that she began to feel guilty and undeserving of be treated so well because she was, in essence, treating our relationship as something only worthy of being thrown away.

Really, that's not "putting her on a pedestal". That's being a good husband.

After DDay, my ex also said she couldn't deal with how I was putting her on a pedestal. That's a bullshit excuse: The best way to "deal with it" is to do it back. Instead of getting uncomfortable and becoming the neighbourhood bicycle, she could have just treated me as an equal, been nice to me, made me feel important.

I once heard someone say on here that the word Love isn't so important as a noun - it's most important use is as a verb. Both parts of a couple should regularly look for ways to make sure the other partner feels how they love them. It really is a remarkably easy thing to do.

Well so far every relationship that has counted has been with an asshole. I'm realizing I'm broken and that's why I picked them. To further traumatize me

but I was attracted to him precisely because he presented as not being an asshole.

It was the asshole behavior that ended my interest in him.

Same Dee that's why I married him. I thought he was different. God it hurts.

[This message edited by crazyblindsided at 1:23 PM, November 14th (Thursday)]

I love how he asked a question he knew the answer to. A large percentage of women like 2 things: Drama and change/duality.

Like a famous rapper once said, "Lady in the street but a freak in the bed."

The response about wanting a tough guy who is kind. Yeah, duality. Beauty and the beast. The line between good guy and doormat is different to the observer. Even read the forums here. The difference between a doormat and a bold in control guy is different to every poster.

I remember when I was younger, I would get dumped by a girl then become a raging jerk. I would have women flying out of the wood work. Then I get into the next relationship and the women would be scared because I treated them "too" good, "Put them on a pedestal."

People hate being put on a pedestal because they feel an obligation to do the same, but they usually fail. Then they feel like a failure and don't deserve the pedestal. It is a screwed up mind trip they do to themselves instead of appreciating the care.

People in the end don't know what they have until it is gone. Obvious. Same as the pedestal and talking about it just makes them think they have a reason they acted out. "It was the pressure." Bull crap.

I think that question could be flipped and generate just as many responses... ARE ASSHOLES ATTRACTED TO DECENT HUMANS?

Assholes go for whoever they can find. Decent people just put up with assholes longer is the problem.

[This message edited by DoinBettr at 1:42 PM, November 14th (Thursday)]

Therein lies the joke.

I’ve heard it said the best vaginas are attached to the craziest women.

I know I prefer strength, solidity, fidelity, honesty.

Well so far every relationship that has counted has been with an asshole. I'm realizing I'm broken and that's why I picked them. To further traumatize me

crazyblindsided:

Do you really think that's true?

Yes I do. It's a scary and sad realization. My IC thinks I'm trying to change the outcome in some way so I end up picking someone on a subconscious level that reminds me of one of my abusers.

Unfortunately I am a child of sexual abuse, gang rape and domestic violence with exbf (one before I met my STBX).

It's why I have decided to finally leave STBX and work on myself for awhile. Not sure if I'll ever have a long-term R again. I hope so but not for awhile.

crazyblindsided:

I am sorry to hear about the abuse you experienced.

Do you think it relates to picking assholes?