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I think these threads head in the wrong direction and sometimes people cannot change how they look as they age obviously same with wrinkles. Maybe we should strive for healthy?

crazyblindsided, we all should strive to be healthy. We cannot

control aging and time. Though we should try to control

weight and be fit as part of being healthy.

Though what you stated did not address that the WS worked

out before their PA being fit for their AP. Then letting

themselves go after D day and refusing to get fit for their BS.

Women and weight as a subject matter never makes for good or productive discussion.

Yeah my husband lost lots of weight for AP. Gym membership diet, gained it all back and more. No more gym. I guess it's no fun if you aren't chatting with AP on the phone while using the elliptical

In a Christian marriage a wife does not own her own body nor does a husband own his own body:

"1 Corinthians 7:3-5 3The husband should fulfill his marital duty to his wife, and likewise the wife to her husband. 4The wife does not have authority over her own body but yields it to her husband. In the same way, the husband does not have authority over his own body but yields it to his wife. 5Do not deprive each other except perhaps by mutual consent"

My issue here (as a woman and a feminist) is the idea that MY body is somehow "owed" to someone else. It does happen both ways, but imho this is a LOT more prevalent for women. The idea that I "better stay in shape for my husband" or "be skinny so I can get a man" that I'm 'less than' if I gain weight, get wrinkles, get gray hair, have a baby and get a stretch mark, live on a planet with gravity that makes my tits not look 18 years old when I'm 40... The list of conditions placed on women's bodies in order for those bodies to be deemed 'worthy' of a man's attention or societal acceptance is literally endless.

My body does not belong to anyone else. My body is not owed to anyone else. My body does not have to conform to someone else's ideas of how it should be or look.

My issue has nothing to do with being or not being a

feminazi (sorry for poking the bear but I like making

jokes) and I agree a woman's body is not owned by anybody.

I do not think that most husbands or wives that (even though

they are highly attracted to their spouse) would not like it if

there spouse lost some wait and toned up more without there

being any affairs.

Though back to no ones a woman's body, not even her

husband. How does the WW refuse to be in as good as shape

for her BH as the WW was for her OM after D day?

I cannot see a WW justifying not meeting her BH's need to

have his WW be as fit for him as she was fit for her OM.

EllieKMAS, how does a WW justify giving her BH a less

physically attractive version herself than the one that she gave

to her OM?

gutpunched, good post.

I have a serious lung disorder, for which I was prescribed a medication that caused me to gain weight, somewhere in the area of 25 pounds.

In 2015, when I was diagnosed, my EXWH was pursuing another woman, though denying it to me the whole time. He had left me a month earlier for "questioning his loyalty," and didn't come home for another month, after it became clear that the OW had no interest in him.

When I called him about my diagnosis, he feigned concern but it was clear he couldn't care less. He was in the middle of pursuing another woman, after all.

And then, when he returned home, instead of concern, he bitched whenever I was in pain, he bitched when I got quiet as a result of being in pain, and then ultimately he bitched about my weight and how we were not going to be "the sexy couple" if I didn't lose it.

While I was fighting my illness, I also was striving to lose weight in order to not lose my husband. I even got a personal trainer, and got up at 5 every morning to meet the trainer at the gym. On the first morning, my EXWH got up with me to warm up the truck. Every other morning thereafter, he stayed in bed, and was still there when I got home from the gym.

He also did ultimately leave me, over the phone right after meeting another OW, and one of the last things he said was, "Shame on me for wanting to be attracted to someone for the rest of my life."

So even though he made it about my weight, it was really about the fact that he didn't love me - or my medication-related weight gain would not have been a marriage-ending issue. So he spent our last years together lusting after other women and masturbating to porn behind my back. Not because I had gained 25 pounds (which I did end up losing), but because he was an unfaithful self-centered asshole.

At the end of the day, we owe it to OURSELVES to be as healthy as we can be, and I have always tried to look as good as I possibly could for my partner.

But just as I wouldn't just completely become a slovenly lazy slob, without any regard for the person who I married - neither would I leave someone who gained a few pounds as they entered middle age, or (as in my case) when they took medication that was designed to save their life. That's not what real love and commitment are about to me.

I also understand what oldtruck was trying to convey about spouses who suddenly get on fitness kicks to make themselves attractive for affair partners, when they wouldn't do so for the people they married. That's awful on a whole 'nother level, and it definitely is common in affair situations.

[This message edited by NorCalLost at 4:05 PM, February 21st (Sunday)]

Bottom line imho, when a ww 'gets fit' for an ap, they are doing so not 'for' the ap, but as a transactional trade for the kibbles they receive. So it just strikes me as rather odd that a BH would make that a conditional thing. I mean... does a BH want their wife to transfer the kibble seeking to them? Does a BH *really* want their wife 'getting fit' simply so they can keep the status quo?

Bottom line is that the WW should be giving and seeking

attention with her BH not just after D day or recovery but for

the rest of their marriage.

When a WW lets herself go after D day and refuses to get fit

again for her BH she is sending the message that her OM was

worth more than her BH because she was putting in the effort

going to the gym for her OM.

Here is a BH willing to do the work to recover his marriage,

show his WW that he still desires her. Yet this BH has to

accept a WW that refuses to be as fit for her BH as she was

willing to be fit for her OM.

EllieKMAS, justify that WW's refusal.

As a woman, the thing that bothers me the most about these posts is that we are more than our bodies. I got down to 112 after dday. It was so beyond unhealthy how I did that. When I look at pictures of myself, sure I was skinny, but I was also battling daily with myself to eat enough to function. It took a lot of work on myself to get myself back to normal. Dday crushed me.

Ideally, at my age I would love to be around 125. I’m at 130 now without putting any effort into it. I hovered around 140 prior to dday. If my WH wanted me to be back at 112 or even 120, I would just divorce him. I will never put myself through that again. It was hell. I’ve had 3 kids and I’m almost 40. I’m perfectly fine where I’m at right now. If he’s not, he can find someone else. I have a job and kids to raise and I have to have some down time and unfortunately I haven’t developed a passion for exercise yet. Maybe some day.

Besides, wrinkles are also a thing. If we get too many wrinkles does that also make us unattractive? Gray hair? At what age are we allowed to age? What if we want to stop wearing makeup? Heels? Do I have 20 more years to look forward to doing my hair, nails, start getting Botox, keeping in shape, etc? When does it end? As a woman, forget the WS/BS it’s just exhausting to think about sometimes. Can’t my spouse just love me and find me attractive for being me at some point? Sorry for the rant, I’m dreading getting ready for work tomorrow while my male coworkers wear shorts and sweatshirts.

When a WW lets herself go after D day and refuses to get fit

again for her BH she is sending the message that her OM was

worth more than her BH because she was putting in the effort

going to the gym for her OM.

I totally agree with this, and it's not just about weight. It's about the overall effort people put in to appeal to affair partners, to treat them better in general.

Towards the end of my marriage, one big red flag was some face cream that my EXWH bought off of an infomercial. He was self-conscious about his face wrinkles, which never bothered me, but he wanted to look good for other women.

It's not necessarily about losing or gaining weight to appeal to affair partners. It's just caring more about an affair partner, to the extent that you would put in the effort to look good for THEM that you wouldn't put in for the person who loves you, who you're in a committed relationship with.

I don't think a truly invested, faithful partner expects - or SHOULD expect - absolute physical perfection. A mature adult in a committed relationship KNOWS that aging happens, wrinkles are a thing, and in many cases, some weight redistribution and gain as well. These are just normal life changes.

What I personally would take issue with is a mate who suddenly stopped caring about his health and appearance at all, who gained an abnormal amount of weight solely due to overeating and lack of exercise, and who didn't love himself or his family enough to do anything about it.

[This message edited by NorCalLost at 4:18 PM, February 21st (Sunday)]

californianative, maybe you were too thin.

Just kidding, your WH did not cheat because of how you

looked. Rather it was what was ugly inside your WH mind that

allowed him to falsely justify his cheating on you.

His actions make no sense just as the countless WH's that had

PA's with countless OW that did not look half as good as their

BW did.

EllieKMAS, how does a WW justify giving her BH a less

physically attractive version herself than the one that she gave

to her OM?

So.... Your ww owes it to you to look a certain way. You keep hammering that point home while saying that's not what you're saying. Pray excuse a little confusion on my part.

Look, I'm not justifying a ws putting in effort for an ap. Of COURSE they should put in more effort for their spouse, especially if they're working for R. I would hope that a ww would be willing to put in the effort for her BH.

But placing a woman's value on her weight or what sexual thing she does is 100% wrong. Take my case. I have struggled with my weight for my whole life. My exdouche fucked a teenager. I am 39 years old. I could work out 15 hours a day and eat nothing but lettuce and my body would STILL not "measure up" to an 18 yo body. CUS BIOLOGY. And cus I'm built like a Viking goddess. Aging just doesn't work that way. But according to your logic, I 'owed' it to my husband to be what he wanted me to be and I 'let myself go' so therefore am less valuable than a herpes-riddled teenager. Yeah I ain't buying that.

Color me crazy but ultimately I care more about the intangible things that aging doesn't affect: kindness, compassion, empathy, humor. Maybe it's just because I'm not thin that I have never placed a ton of importance on outer beauty.

Whether it's about their weight, attractiveness, sexual adventureness, gift buying gifts or any thing else they did for the POS and not for us, we are all complaining about EFFORT... We are all upset about them not putting out more effort for us. Effort that was misspent to please the POS that SHOULD have been spent to improve the marriage. Every BS cries out to see their WS put forth not just effort, but MORE effort than they put out for their POS.

I read this as the real point of the OP. If he had used his wife taking cooking classes so she could make gourmet meals for AP then only served her BH frozen pizza this would be a very different conversation.

I have been on both sides of the weight thing having someone decide you’re too skinny and need to be fattened up is just as frustrating as being told you’re now too fat. Especially when it comes from the same person who has also gained weight.

Besides, wrinkles are also a thing. If we get too many wrinkles does that also make us unattractive? Gray hair? At what age are we allowed to age? What if we want to stop wearing makeup? Heels? Do I have 20 more years to look forward to doing my hair, nails, start getting Botox, keeping in shape, etc? When does it end? As a woman, forget the WS/BS it’s just exhausting to think about sometimes. Can’t my spouse just love me and find me attractive for being me at some point?

Nope none of this is allowed apparently. No aging into the glorious swamp witches we are meant to be cus we owe it to the dewds to remain attractive at all times. 40 is the new 20, hadn't you heard?

Whoops. My sarcasm is showing

I get the overall point of this post. If there was ANYTHING my WH did for the OW and wasn’t willing to do the same for me, it’d bug the hell out of me. Sometimes it’s the fact he has a new job and can’t be on his phone much, but was always texting her. It makes 100% sense why he isn’t able to communicate with me as often, but it still bothers me sometimes.

He started going to the gym after d-day, but never did during his A. I think it’s partly because he’s snooped on a few of my posts and has seen where I’ve said I’m less attracted to him after discovering his infidelity. He has made it pretty clear he’s afraid I’ll leave him, and is doing his best to keep me attracted to him. It’s a really weird position to be in to be honest. One that’s brand new to me, as he’s always been considered extremely good looking, and I did put on some weight after having kids. I’ve lost about 30 lbs since d-day and have kept it off. Still, I don’t like it because no one should be afraid their spouse will leave them if the gain some weight, or let themselves go a bit. On the other hand, I can’t help it that after his A I am genuinely less attracted to him, and if he DID put on a bunch of weight, I think I’d lose even more of it. I don’t believe I’d ever feel this way if he had never cheated.

We aren’t “normal” married couples, so I think it’s important to get to the root of why we are feeling the way we are. A lot of the time it does go back to their infidelity.

Ideally, at my age I would love to be around 125.

Then be 125 for yourself. Make yourself feel good.

Besides, wrinkles are also a thing. If we get too many wrinkles does that also make us unattractive? Gray hair? At what age are we allowed to age? What if we want to stop wearing makeup? Heels?

My wife keeps her hair the same dark brunette color. She

refuses to go gray. She does it for herself. If she went gray I

would handle it. Women do not need make up, lots of sexy

shoes out there without heels. I do not need to have women

with their nails painted to look hot. Make up for everyday

forget about it, just some lipstick is enough.

keeping in shape, When does it end? Can’t my spouse just love me and find me attractive for being me at some point?

Keeping in shape is more than looking the best you can at any

age it is about part of being the healthiest you can be at any

age.

Sorry for the rant, I’m dreading getting ready for work tomorrow while my male coworkers wear shorts and sweatshirts.

You did not write anything to apologize for. Though why not

wear shorts and sweat shirts if the men do?

Nope none of this is allowed apparently. No aging into the glorious swamp witches we are meant to be cus we owe it to the dewds to remain attractive at all times. 40 is the new 20, hadn't you heard?

Whoops. My sarcasm is showing

Eh, I’ve never even owned any makeup, I’d break an ankle in heels and I started getting grey 5 years before I got married he knew what he was getting into. After a couple of decades 2 kids and 2 abdominal surgeries, if weight, grey or scars are a dealbreaker that’s not my problem.

Too all viking goddesses and EllieKMAS, that were not WW's

I never said that you should hit the gym and become skinnier

and get better muscle tone than their WH OW.

As unstuffedgiraffe said if the WW took cooking classes for

her OM and now after D day will only make kraft macaroni

and cheese, canned soup, frozen pizza.

Or when the BH complains after D day the OM got the full

sex menu and the WW still limits the BH to the no salt no fat

menu sex.

Or when the BH complains that the WW took off a lot of

weight for her OM then put on a lot of weight after D day

and won't take it off for her BH.

What do all things have in common?

Many BW response for from their personal view after D day,

is no man owns my body. They cannot see that a WW

should have to step up to the plate and give to their BH

as good as these WW gave to their OM.

How does a WW justify that she is not going to have to give

BH as good as she gave her OM to make just compensations

to her BH?

FWW's see the BH's need for this form of just compensation.

It is not about owning a WW body rather a WW giving

herself to her BH as good as she gave to her OM to balance

things out. Showing her BH that she values him.

But so often when we are discussing effort made by the woman it circles back to either their weight or what hole the AP was allowed. It turns the conversation from the effort to viewing a woman's body as a commodity for a man. That vague kind of objectification is a notion that is steeped in the history of women being viewed as chattel, of women being subservient and there to 'do' for a man.

Agree. And so often the men making these statements are less than ideal weight-wise themselves. I just don't see how you can marry a person and assume they are going to stay fit and thin. My WS gained 35-40lbs over the course of a few years into our short marriage. He was objectively a hunk when we met, and then he looked like a regular doughy middle aged guy and I still adored him and was attracted to him. Women are always blamed for aging like it's a lack of effort or a moral failing.

As to effort - losing weight and maintaining thinness is one of the most impossible tasks. After a certain age weight loss is ridiculously hard. However, when your adrenalin is pumping from lying and sneaking around, and your endorphins are gushing from fresh kibbles not eating is the easiest freaking thing in the world to do. So no she didn't put in a lot of effort. It just looked that way.

The effort was monumental when she was married and things were status quo. The effort was minimal once she started being unfaithful.

[This message edited by skeetermooch at 5:18 PM, February 21st (Sunday)]

For me, attractiveness is really hard to quantify. It is a combination of so many things beyond the physical. But to ignore the physical, is to be disingenuous. It is one component of many. When I was with my STBXWW, prior to the skankiness, I loved her body, not because of her body, but because it was the body she had. Had she another body, I would have loved that as much.

This is something that I dont think she can or ever could comprehend. For her, love was transactional, a spreadsheet of debits and credits. Deep in her affair, she asked me why I loved her. Not knowing of her betrayal, I said, because I choose to. She was incredulous.