SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

On August 22nd when I was setting up Youtube for my youngest on my wife's work computer (work from home due to pandemic) I noticed some messages on Teams that my wife had left open. The messages signalled her intention to enter into an affair with a highschool friend with whom she had recently reconnected after 20 years. Her coworker was encouraging her to go through with this.

I didn't immediately confront her but just observed and started to dig. Over the course of the next couple days she became very secretive and obsessive about her phone. She asked me to put a passcode on it (she is not very tech savvy) saying that as they were about to go back to work in the office in a couple weeks she needed a passcode to protect her phone. This immediately made me more suspicious as she has had a phone for 20 years and never before felt the need for a passcode.

But i had no proof of anything going on so I didn't make an issue of it at the time. She had gone to the bar with this friend on the 16th and went to another friends house afterwards. She came home at 4am, piss loaded drunk and was a complete write off the next day. I was pissed as she has never done this before and I was left with the kids for a day and a half with no assistance from her whatsoever. I have never done this to her either.

A few days later she went to dinner under the pretext of meeting with a girlfriend of hers. I didn't believe her but still never confronted her. Turns out she met her AP there and went back to his house afterwards.

A few more days later, prior to us leaving on a family trip, she told me that her AP hurt his shoulder and needed some T3's that she had. She told me he's just a friend and you have nothing to worry about. Right. So she went, and was there for over an hour. We went on our trip and I was very cold and distant because my gut feeling was that he was not "just a friend" and that I indeed had plenty to worry about. The whole trip she was texting him constantly. This was over the August long weekend (first weekend in August for us).

Finally I was able to get into her phone by shoulder surfing her passcode. What I found was thousands of text messages of very explicit content wherein she admits to being in an affair, lying to me about meeting her girlfriend for supper, etc. I install SMS backup and restore on her phone and ended up getting hourly backups of her text messages.

On the 2nd I printed her conversation and left it for her to find with my wedding ring. She starts blowing up my phone and texting me that it was all online, nothing happened and there was no physical contact. She swears that because his mother was there they didn't have sex, "what kind of woman do you think I am that I would have sex with someone when there mother is there". Well, we have had sex at my mother's house when she was there! She also tells me this is my fault as I forced her to seek attention elsewhere. We have never had a dead bedroom, but admittedly we don't have sex often as I am relatively low libido, and we have three kids. Also, for the last three years I haven't slept in my own bed with her as she has co-slept with two of the kids for the last three years. How much sex could we have when we have three young kids who scream after us as soon as we leave the room?

She gets me to back down a bit (frankly I just wanted the argument to end, and I tend to be one who doesn't stand up for himself much). So I largely acquiesce to her argument, but I still can't shake the feeling that her story is bullshit.

So I look the following day and I find text messages to her AP and her friends (who all seem to know about this) telling them to tell me it was all online and nothing happened. Her AP even said "are you sure this is the way" and the other friend said "I will, but he might already know everything". So she is setting up a cover story. I tell her I want a divorce but she doubles down on her story.

She even goes so far as to offer to take a polygraph to prove her story. I agree, even though I think they are little more than a circus trick at this point. I overhear two conversations between her AP after all this in which she states:

-He told me I'm not allowed to go the bedroom with you, but if I get a chance we will do it again.
-She intends to use marriage counselling (which I agreed to) to push for an open marriage.
-She intends to game the polygraph by asking irrelevant questions.
-She says "I told him I didn't fuck you...I'm still going with that by the way"

That week was the end of her work from home period. Knowing that that would be her last opportunity to meet up with him, and that he generally has Fridays off, I suspected that she would try to meet up with him. Sure enough, she calls him at lunch to meetup with him. She swears it was just for lunch, but I doubt it. He had the good sense to say that it probably wouldn't be a good idea so they didn't meet. We even had a "first date" towards reconciliation scheduled that night!

So a couple days later she goes for the polygraph which comes back inconclusive. But I learn also that she tried to game it by taking Lorazepam that she got from a co-worker and trying the "tack in the shoe trick". I have also seen that she has googled how to pass a polygraph. The company retests in the case of an inconclusive result. This time she passes. I had removed the tack from her coin purse but she still took a bunch of Lorazepam before the test that she didn't tell the examiner about. I had switched the pills that she got from her coworker, but she picked up another prescription of her own for this stuff, so she still had access to it.

I call bullshit on the test.

She got very angry with me because she passed and her story is true. However, I still cannot reconcile what is in the text messages with her story. There are too many details that do not square with a fantasy, such as things like vaginal bleeding after fingering. Funny thing is she had me finger her a couple days later and there was, once again, blood. Honestly, who puts a detail like that in a fantasy? She has also gloated about her conquest to her friends, telling them that she had sex with him. When I questioned her on this point she said that she just wanted the attention, because, you know, you don’t give me any. Oookkk, veneer of plausibility I guess, but likely?

This is getting long but she is continually invalidating my feelings, trying to make me feel like I am crazy, not to mention paranoid, for invading her privacy, etc. She is telling me to "just get over it" and calm down and wants things to go back to the way they were before. It is absolutely infuriating. I am devestated by this emotionally, physically. This has been the worst experience of my life, and I have been to fucking war! Even that was less anxiety inducing than this was.

But hey, I don’t have any actual proof so it allows her to deny, deny, deny. I have consulted with a lawyer and now have him on retainer. But we have kids, home, etc. And I make less than her so I am afraid of the financial implications of separation and worry that I will not be able to provide a place to live. I want 50/50 custody, but need a financial base to provide for the kids and that I worry that I don’t have. Really want to pull the trigger on the divorce but am waffling on this. I at least got to speak to a therapist today and she validated my concerns and feelings here, so that, at least was nice.

She is still on contact with AP, despite my asking her to cease contact. Even if was just online/fantasy I still am gutted by this. She asked tonight if she could have some "special attention". I said no, not ready. She then asked if she could text AP for some attention. Really, what do you think?! Am I just a human dildo? Don't we need to fix this - if we can fix this - first?

I just don't know what to do anymore. I feel like I am being manipulated and lied too, like I'm crazy.

Anyway, while there is more i could write, I will cut this off here as it’s getting rather long!

Thanks for reading.

First, don’t tell her how you get your information. Don’t tell her you are posting on SI.

Second none of this is your fault. It was her choice and her decisions.

your WW is having an A right in front of you and is even not trying to hide it too much. She has no empathy, no remorse.

Your main goal is to get out of this situation, to get out of infidelity like we say around here.

You can either get out of infidelity by Reconciling if your WW stops lying, kills the A and focus on fixing herself and your marriage. Or you can Divorce.

At this point in time, you don’t have much of a choice. Try to detach from her, do « the 180 ». Sleep in a separate room, don’t do anything with her. She CHOSE to bring a man in your marriage and as long as it stays like that, it’s best to continue with D. Don’t have sex with her, you don’t know where the OM has been. Get tested for STDs.

Is the OM married?

Others will come along with similar advice. Keep in mind that all posters here have gone through this. We speak from experience.

Post often ,you have been heard.

Sorry for your loss. Stay strong and don't tolerate the lies, gaslighting and disrespect. There is nothing to work with here for R.

Dear (((reddy)))

You have come to the right place for support and advice. I am so sorry for your need for help, it is a horrible thing to deal with, learning your WW (wayward wife) is in an affair.

I just don't know what to do anymore. I feel like I am being manipulated and lied too, like I'm crazy.

You have started correctly by getting an attorney. YES you are clearly being manipulated and lied too. SHE IS IN A PHYSICAL AFFAIR! You know that! You do not need to walk in to know she has had sex with him (I did that). Now what do you want! R (reconciliation) or is an affair a deal breaker and you want a D (Divorce).

Cheaters learn quickly to lie then lie and deny deny deny. Do not believe a word she is saying. As long as she is in contact with her AP she is in the affair.

A hard line is always the best way to save your marriage. Do find out who the AP is, like is he married, will his job be affected by an affair. Exposure is almost always the best way to end an affair and break the "fog". Call his mother or wife, tell your and her family. Affairs' tend to thrive in secrecy. You could also start the D process to see if this breaks her out of this affair.

You must sit her down and let her know calmly that you refuse to share her. No to MC absolutely NO MC, she needs to end the affair she needs IC. She is the problem not the marriage.

Now take care of yourself, water, food and exercise. Consider doing things on your own, like joining the gym.

So much more advice coming your way from far smarter men and women than me.

Respectfully,

Organic2003

[This message edited by Organic2003 at 4:51 AM, Tuesday, August 24th]

Reddy, if you spend any time reading here, you already know your WW is screwing her AP. You have more than enough evidence.

Divorce isn’t something to take lightly, especially with kids involved, but what do you or your kids gain by staying in this situation?

One poster (a month or two back) whiteness his WW holding hands at a dinner party. He caught a glimpse of it, and she immediately pulled away, but that was enough. He dug, found more than enough proof of an affair. You have more than enough proof.

Your WW is gaslighting you and carrying on an affair right in front of you. Deep down, you know what you need to do….remove yourself from infidelity!

Bro everything is clear and cut, but you are still bent on blindfolding yourself and take bullshit from her.Why are you letting her control the narrative.The way that she responds already shows zero remorse and you are flipflopping between getting divorce or not.Listen, you are a healthy working dude, nothing will happen after the divorce, you can manage it at that time.IF you continue to handle her bullshit, your mental health will be destroyed.And why the hell did you need proof for cofronting her?? You know you don't love her anymore , but still you don't have the courage to pull the trigger.Brother at least try to stand up for yourself now. Your wife has already lost respect for you

So her version of the affair changes depending on who she's talking to? If she's talking to you it's just an online affair and nothing physical happened. When it comes to friends who encourages her actions, they already had sex.

Two versions of a similar story. Which one to believe? I believe the latter version because physical evidences suggest that yes, it is highly physical. She spent the night with her AP. Adults don't just do nothing for the night.

Look, you're obviously intelligent. We don't have to tell you what's going on here. You know what's gone down and you know what you have to do. Fear, shock, dread, heartbreak and mourning the sudden loss of your marriage is causing you to bargain and deny. Bargaining and denial are stages of grief. You have just suffered a great loss. They say discovering infidelity is a stressor second only to the loss of a child. Cheaters take advantage of this state of grief and use it to manipulate you. Their tactics are so standard, they are a cliché around here and documented in The Cheater's Playbook. Take a trip on the wildside and visit the adulterer's section on Reddit. There they share cheater trade-craft and Opsec. Cheaters typically will gaslight you, doormat you, minimize the affair, blame shift, rewrite the history of the marriage, rally cheater cronies, victimize themselves, DARVO (Deny, Attack, Reverse Victim and Offender), love bomb, sex bomb, make overly dramatic declarations of love and regret, etc, etc.

What you want to see is ACTION and Pro-action, not words, not games, not selfishness.

You don't need to prove a damn thing. You already have ample evidence of lying, cheating, deceit, back stabbing, conspiracy, subterfuge, desecration of all your marital vows, and profound disrespect. Even if it was JUST an EA, you have enough to walk. At this point, intercourse would be purely incidental.

But we're all adults here. We don't need a polygraph. Your WW split the farm in every meaningful way-including full on sex.

I'm sorry but, you're WW is totally blowing it. At this point, she is not R material. If she doesn't have an epiphany of profound remorse soon, I'd be serving her with D papers. Nothing shocks a Wayward out of their bullshit like formal process served crispy legal pressed Divorce Papers.

If she has a Devine epiphany of profound remorse and throws everything she's got into saving you and the marriage then, THEN you can slow or pause the divorce process and watch how things play out.

Her current state of mind is not conducive to any sort of relationship, let alone, a marriage. She's toxic to you and kids. This whole situation is a toxic cesspool. Focus on saving yourself and the kids and the family coffers.

Be preparred for the unpredictable. Watch for out of character behavior. I'm talking like false DV charges. Carry a VAR on you when in her presence. Busted unremorseful cheaters commonly lash out at their BS's, demonize them, character attack, and try and isolate the BS from their support systems. Protect yourself.

There will be more savy information coming your way.

[This message edited by RealityBlows at 5:37 AM, Tuesday, August 24th]

reddy -

Never have I seen a more cleae cut case of "nothing to work with".

Serve her.

Lose a cheater, gain a life.

You have a ton of evidence that she is physically cheating and will not stop. She wants an open marriage. File for divorce. If by some miracle there is something to work with down the line, maybe you can save the marriage. But from your story, it is extremely doubtful.

If you stay, you will have a one-sided open marriage. Is that what you are willing to accept? If so, good luck to you. Otherwise, file for divorce. You can successfully co-parent if both of you work at it. Having children should not sentence you to a life of disrespect, humiliation, and misery.

Thank you all for the responses, and words of support.

I have just now overheard a conversation wherein she says that she lied on the test. She goes on to joke that it was easy and "she should be a bank robber". Har Har.

So, what was once 99.9% certain is now 100% certain. I will be moving for divorce. I already have a lawyer on retainer and his assistant emailed me today to see about setting up an appointment for sometime this week.

I just, for whatever reason, needed to know for sure.

My problem though, is that she is going to be able to control the narrative with her polygraph results. If I leave she is going to turn around and scream "see...Polygraph!". As though a polygraph were unassailable. I suspect she is the reason these things have fallen out of favour with the courts!

Whatever though, we no longer have mutual friends as they have all been posted out of the area. It's mostly her family, most of whom I have never really been that close with anyway, other than her mum and dad. I don't know how that will shake out, as her dad cheated on her mum when she was pregnant with STBXW. Mum had the good sense to leave him immediately.

I have already once told her I wanted a divorce, but she argued me out of it. Well, not really, I acquiesced more to end the argument which had gone on for some time already. Nonetheless, I have always been pretty non-confrontational, doormat frankly and have never been very good at asserting myself. Something to work on, although I really don't see entering the dating scene for a very long time, if ever.

The AP is divorced. Through her text messages she has tried to see if he might be game for more than sex, but he has consistently refused to deepen the relationship and has stated that he is not interested.

I did get STD tested. She got very angry with me when I brought home the paperwork and she saw it. She took it as me not believing her story. Well no shit! I come to find out later that she got STD tested as well and hid it from me. Wonder why?!

Reconciliation is off the table. Even if formal divorce paperwork shakes her out of her fog, she is a snake. If she had just come clean, instead of concocting this ridiculous stew of bullshit, maybe, just maybe, we might have had a chance. But at this point, after three weeks of manipulation, blameshifting, deceit, I am a wreck, and I just can't do it anymore.

Its funny because even her AP questioned her judgement on her strategy here. It's really weird but I sense more remorse from him. I know exactly who he is and even where he lives. Apparently he is quite afraid of me and is worried about me coming after him. I won't, but nonetheless would like to tell him, as well as her co-conspirators at work, to hang themselves. It would make the world a better place. How could they do this to our family, our kids? It makes me so fucking angry.

This is a good update. It seems you're already on your way for a D. Are you going to file for adultery? Do you live in a place where adultery counts? I know you gathered enough evidences as per your previous messages.

All the best and good luck!

Hey! It doesn't matter if he stuck his dick in her. She has utterly betrayed, disrespected and willfully traumatized and abused you in every other conceivable and meaningful way. The courts don't give a rat's ass about the sex and the stupid polygraph-if you live in a no fault state. The evidence you collected is for you and your personal decision making process. It's actually not your decision anyways. She has already decided for the both of you to end your marriage. Your marriage is already over. Grab the kids and the dog and get out of the burning house. Don't worry about her, she's already left you all to burn. She's standing out on the curb looking back at the inferno and laughing.

Get to work and stop fucking around! Don't tell her what you're doing. Don't telegraph your moves. Let the process server tell her what's happening next. Grey stone her. Only talk to her through your respective attorneys.

You're worried she makes more money than you?? That's awesome! You get alimony!

Protect yourself. You're now at war. The woman you trusted and thought loved you has left the stage.

Your WW scares the hell out of me. I would not screw around and compromise yourself in any way.

You are now starting a new chapter in your life. Hit the gym and get in shape. You're gonna be dating soon and will find a world full of wonderful lonely women looking for someone true. Your attorney will lay down the path out of this shit show and you will begin to see the light at the end of this tunnel.

[This message edited by RealityBlows at 7:36 AM, Tuesday, August 24th]

Everything you suspect and think is true, is true. What a liar she is. You have tons of evidence from her stupid convos with that POS and her enabling friends. And she's still pushing all those ffffing lies and denials. She really is garbage.

It's time to get into D mode and walk it back if that's what you want if she commensurately responds. In all this, from what you have posted, she's a lying schemer with tales taller than the sequoias.

Your cheating W is so woven into a network of rotten enabling "friends" and lies that this might never be reversible. The worst of it is her viewing this POSOM as some kind of trophy animal mounted on the wall. As in: see, I'm great, I got HIM.

Wow…
There are some things that amaze me in this story and I have been around for quite some time…
First of all: I hate assumptions. If your wife claims there was no sex then I’m OK with going along with the possibility of there not having been sex, but frankly I think that sandcastle won’t stand the draft when you open the next door. In fact your second post sort-of blew it down completely.

What can often be a good strategy when analyzing what you have is to think when "normal" people might do things. If I take some examples:

Her coworker was encouraging her to go through with this…
At what time would you start talking to your work colleague about your plans to have an affair? I don’t think this conversation is something that develops from talking about last weeks sales-figures. There is some build-up, some background here.

Messages to her friends…
So basically everyone was in the know. Other than you… I always find it extremely worrying when a WS is confident enough in what they do to share with friendS – as in plural. I also find it worrying when one of the friends doesn’t have the integrity to – at the very least – stop the WS or preferably talk to the BS.

Corroborating story…
Wouldn’t be necessary if it was all cut-and-clear. Wouldn’t be necessary if the only "story" was what WS shared with the friends, rather than what the friends experienced and saw.

Mom in house as an excuse for no sex…
Come on! First of all we could argue about the definition of sex. We have had several WS claim there was no sex because there wasn’t penetration, or it was only oral, or it was only groping, or neither were naked… Whatever… IMHO sex is anything that is designed or intended to create sexual emotions or release to the other person. If the OM got off to someone singing Yankee Doodle while wearing a hat and your wife did exactly that to get him off it’s sex IMHO.

Your fault…
Wow… just wow… I always wonder at the stupidity of that excuse. Let’s imagine in some fantasy that it was true. So something YOU did (or did not do) made her HAVE TO go find another man, flirt with him and maybe even have sex (see how I don’t assume…). The reaction to what you did/did not do was to have an affair and it’s YOUR FAULT.
So what if you patch things up now, but maybe 2 years from now you forget to take out the trash? Would that be a good enough reason for her to blow the FedEx guy?
Is her reaction to what you did or did not do in any way correct or logical?
Think not. The moment the WS claims it’s your fault is the moment you realize that there is no recovery. A KEY element to reconciliation is the acceptance of total blame and accountability. No discount.

The number of messages with sexual content or inuendo…
Look – at what point in a relationship do you start being sexual? In what order? I’m old… If I wanted to send a dick-pick back in my days it involved Kodak and processing, envelopes and stamp-licking. Even then I’m certain the only result would have been a knock at my door by the local police. I realize things might have changed, but if I was really into someone would I risk that relationship by STARTING with sexual content? There is a build-up and the sexual content generally starts once a certain basis has been established – very often sex.

OK – with all that plus how you describe her attitude…

The only way to deal with infidelity is through reality.
I think a marriage can be reconciled from any situation where both want to reconcile and are willing to do the work. However that has to be done from a base of truth and knowledge. Right now you don’t have that and she isn’t willing to give it, therefore there is no basis for even considering reconciliation. If that is true, then the only logical option is divorce.

You don’t have to justify divorce to anyone other than yourself.
The only relevance her infidelity might have been if you are in one of the few remaining places where infidelity can impact divorce. If so you hire an attorney that finds a PI and does the work needed to get proof. If not – then the infidelity doesn’t matter as far as the D process is concerned.

Nor do you need to prove to anyone that she is having an affair, beat the poly or whatever.
Your good friend Fred asks why you are divorcing: "She’s having an affair". If he presses "She denies it was physical but I believe it was. Not that it matters – there was enough emotional and sexual content to convince me". And that’s it. You don’t show blood-samples, fingerprint analysis, voice stress analysis or glossy photos. You don’t have to prove anything.

Her friend Jane confronts you with "she says it wasn’t physical" your response "well… I believe it was, but even then there was enough to convince me to file" and that’s it.

Bob – the guy you play golf with every second month – if he was to ask why you are divorcing: "none of your business…"

YOU DON’T HAVE TO PROVE OR JUSTIFY ANYTHING FOR ANYONE ELSE!
Versions of the above three answers are enough for anyone that asks.

Now – what would be required for you to stop any D process?
A believable truth. Even if that truth is worse than you already know.

---
Extra question:

Could you elaborate on the polygraph process?
Were you allowed input on the questions? How many questions? Could you share them with us (can change names as needed)?
A reputable tester will have a very defined process and frankly based on what you share I don’t see that… A reputable tester would also have processes in place to spot cheating. The way you describe the process sounds very… fairground-like.

You are taking a good approach to get out of infidelity.

The OM doesn’t want a relationship with your WW because he realizes he would be with a cheater. A woman who is destroying her family for no good reason. She is not girlfriend material.

Like others have said, you don’t need proof to show anyone.

You don’t need to argue with your WW that she is cheating. Don’t argue with her. It’s like a telemarketer call, you don’t argue with them that you don’t want a condo in Acapulco. You say not interested and hang up.

You tell your WW that you know she had and A and you are D her. As long as she is lying and not taking responsibility, just say "I’m sorry you feel that way" Then walk away. Don’t argue.

It’s the same with D. You don’t need her approval. Any gaslight attempt from her will hurt you.

You say you have trouble standing for yourself but the steps you are taking are very self assertive.

Let us know how your story proceed

[This message edited by ShutterHappy at 2:23 PM, Tuesday, August 24th]

Go to the healing library here, read up on the 180 and implement. You might want to download No More Mr. Nice Guy. Start putting you and the kids first.

Quit arguing with this sick, sick manipulative woman. You don't need further proof. File for divorce and move on with your life.

[This message edited by Thumos at 2:21 PM, Tuesday, August 24th]

Quit arguing with this sick, sick manipulative woman. You don't need further proof. File for divorce and move on with your life.

This. Stop giving your psychopathic WW power over your life. See an attorney. Follow their advice to the letter. Treating her like a telemarketer is good advice. It doesn't matter. I'm done with you is a good enough response. You should have been carrying a VAR weeks ago. She sounds evil enough to try and frame you for domestic violence. Having proof of the lies she will saying would shut down any narrative that this is your fault. She's going to get ugly when it's clear you taking your life back away from her. Just keep putting one foot in front of the other and walk free of this marriage to this destructive person.

She then asked if she could text AP for some attention

This made me sick. She has no intention of stopping this other relationship. And yes, they were intimate.

She is toxic and manipulative. Don't engage in any conversations with her; use your attorney.

Your kids will be fine, and you will be fine. It's hard to go through but once you're on the other side of it you'll be glad that you didn't allow her to run your life. Still, I'm sorry it has come to this.